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Blair

Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
does any1 here think that blair has and had a secret agenda all along, y did he join the labour party, his father was a conservative, tony didn't have trad labour views, he wasn't a socialist, blair culd've joined the tories and argued for the right just as easily for the left if he wanted to, he looked at both parties and realised the tories were sort on time at the top, since then and since he became leader it has become apparent that labour, dare i say, have become to the right or certainly closer to the right. he's also been a puppet for world leaders, it almost makes u feel sorry for him, for instance, blair didn't sort out northern irelands problems because he wanted to, bill clinton was under pressure by irish-american groups to sort the problem out, clinton in turn asked blair and blair being the "like-ass" that he is, did so, same again with the war in iraq, if blair had any sense he'd tell bush to go fcuk himself but the relations between the two were obviously more important than hundreds of american,british soldiers and hundreds of iraqis lives. blair resign now and get a true leftist in.

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  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Re: Blair
    Originally posted by turlough
    does any1 here think that blair has and had a secret agenda all along, y did he join the labour party, his father was a conservative, tony didn't have trad labour views, he wasn't a socialist, blair culd've joined the tories and argued for the right just as easily for the left if he wanted to, he looked at both parties and realised the tories were sort on time at the top, since then and since he became leader it has become apparent that labour, dare i say, have become to the right or certainly closer to the right. he's also been a puppet for world leaders, it almost makes u feel sorry for him, for instance, blair didn't sort out northern irelands problems because he wanted to, bill clinton was under pressure by irish-american groups to sort the problem out, clinton in turn asked blair and blair being the "like-ass" that he is, did so, same again with the war in iraq, if blair had any sense he'd tell bush to go fcuk himself but the relations between the two were obviously more important than hundreds of american,british soldiers and hundreds of iraqis lives. blair resign now and get a true leftist in.

    I agree totally. Blair started politics in 1982 and I think it's important to look at the political situation then. You had the Falklands War, the Conservatives were high in the opinion polls, Mrs Thatcher looked unassailable and would remain so for another eight years. The Tories were at the time seen to be attracting the young movers and shakers of the future and there was a very long list of potential leaders of the Tory Party.

    Then you had the Labour Party in 1982... the year before some of the (at the time) right wing members of the party had actually left the party to form the SDP. Meanwhile the majority of the party were fighting the Militant Tendency and other hard left/Communist factions which were trying to infiltrate the party. In short it was split from top to bottom. You had Michael Foot as leader, a great man of principles and knowledge but awful for the television age. Labour's campaigning technique in the 1980s was dire, it had no sense of controlling the agenda, no comprehension of how best to portray themselves on television, no organisational efficency. By the time Blair had climbed the ladder all the hard work had been done - Kinnock had expelled the Militant Tendency in 1985, Brian Gould had vastly improved Labour's campaigning technique firstly in 1987 and then in 1992. The end of the Cold War in 1989-91 had made Labour's problems over defence and specifically nuclear weapons seem unimportant.

    After the death of John Smith which I think is probably one of the greatest tragedies to befall the Labour Party, you had a party which had lost its third election in a row by a very narrow margin when it had expected to win and Labour people were so desperate for power they backed Blair and so the Tory Boy could walk to his first election victory and impliment his damaging policies.

    I can't believe there isn't more pressure for Blair to resign - the Hutton Inquiry has shown that he lied to the country over the war in Iraq. He is desperate to push through unpopular policies like foundation hospitals and university top-up fees which the party hates and will reduce our popularity in the country. Labour needs to get rid of Blair and bring in a proper Labour Prime Minister to undo the damage he and his fellow Tories have wreaked.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Well, if he is trying to reduce faith in the Labour Party he is going the right way about it.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    You forget though Kevlar that it was actually Kinnock who really put "New" Labour into motion during the run-up to the 1992 election, and John Smith would have done a lot of what Blair has done anyway, though he may have been more honest about it.

    Labour, whenever they have been in power, have shown that they cannot be trusted to use it properly. The Conservatives are wrong on many issues, but they know how to rule properly.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Kermit
    You forget though Kevlar that it was actually Kinnock who really put "New" Labour into motion during the run-up to the 1992 election, and John Smith would have done a lot of what Blair has done anyway, though he may have been more honest about it.

    Labour, whenever they have been in power, have shown that they cannot be trusted to use it properly. The Conservatives are wrong on many issues, but they know how to rule properly.

    Depends what you'd define as "New" Labour. If you look at the policies in the 1992 Labour manifesto you could easily say that it was consistent with Labour beliefs and is easily a left of centre platform. If you mean campaigning technique that was really started back in 1987 but in 1992 Labour still didn't appreciate short punchy slogans like "Labour's Tax Bombshell" or "Labour's Double Whammy" that the Tories used against them. Also Kinnock was a factor in us losing the election, as he admits himself, not only for the Sheffield Rally but also because of him personally. Smith would have been a lot more Labour-like than Blair is, Smith was a strong believer in redistribution and improving public services by working with the people who work in the industry rather than attacking them. In many ways, I believe Gordon Brown is very much like Smith.

    I disagree with your last point. Labour has been very unlucky in that it always comes to power when the Tories cock up and so has to sort out their mess before they can do what they want. When Clem Atlee came to power the country was virtually bankrupt from the war and rationing had to increase so he got the economy through the hard times - and it is a credit to him that he also managed to create the welfare state and pursue most of his platform. When things were finally getting better the Tories were voted in and able to take credit for the economic success. Under the Wilson governments of the 60s there were few hinderances which led to him winning in 1964, 66 and only narrowly losing in 1970 and he was able to push forward with his platform and the Tories had to agree with a lot of what he did because it was popular. Then the Labour government of the 70s got battered by the oil crisis which led to the high inflation which led to the Winter of Discontent which led to the Thatcher era. Incidentally, Callaghan had managed to get inflation under control by May 1979 and the situation was slowly improving. Then Thatcher came in and was sustained in power by the Falklands War, privatisation receipts and North Sea Oil which managed to hide her governments economic incompetence - let's not forget that it was the Tories who took us into the two worst recessions since the Depression, trebled unemployment, doubled crime and started an uncontrollable economic inflationary boom while underinvesting in our public services.

    But ending on a note of agreement - the sooner Blair goes the better.
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