Thought it was over... Guess again

Former Member · November 2002

Just read this.

Should the man recieve a 5-star treatment and a thank-you note by world leaders, for having managed to prove that airline security isn't as it should be? Or should he actually be held accountable for the action which he was well on his way, to commit?

[/Thought of the day]

Former Member · November 2002

Silly. As long as planes carry passengers, it will never be over. We live in a world innately vulnerable to terrorism and if we took the measures necessary to change that, people would soon be roaring about the infringement of their civil liberties.

The only other option is to look into the causes of terrorism, which are varied, and treat the disease rather than the symptoms. Doesn't win elections, that.

Former Member · November 2002

Its sad but there is always going to be terrorism, its a fact of life just like paying taxes and dying.
Doesn't make it right and its not nice but nether is childbirth i hear.
Terrorism, like childbirth, has been around since man could terrorize one another... But I'm not comparing terrorism to childbirth now!

You can never stop it, you can slow it down, you can make it more difficult to grow, its like a cancer. In doing this you make them more determined to succeed.

First it starts off as a noble cause, or noble in their own head, but then it normally becomes a money making organizations. The crusades, Nazis, IRA and now maybe Mr. Bush... There are allot of oil fields where he is planning to go next, but i can't talk, I'm British and everyone know how great our empire was at one time, sure we bought civilization to other countries not so civilized but we had our own agenda and these countries had lots of natural resources and spoils.

Maybe everyone is as bad as one another, we can only see what the media lets us see. Unfortunately it shapes minds.

Former Member · November 2002

Originally posted by Uncle Joe
Silly. As long as planes carry passengers, it will never be over. We live in a world innately vulnerable to terrorism and if we took the measures necessary to change that, people would soon be roaring about the infringement of their civil liberties.

What do you know, we agree on something.

Doesn't matter if there are planes, trains or whatever. Terrorism dates back as far as recorded history. Just part of the human condition. We can make it rarer, difficult, expensive for those who would attempt it... we will never eradicate it. There are always those who will hate and they will find a reason.

Former Member · November 2002

Originally posted by Ocultus
God and the soldier...

While it's not germane to the discussion, your signature lines sounded like the sort of thing Kipling would have said, so, out of curiosity, I did a search. It turns out to be quite a popular verse, turning up in various guises:

http://www.cswnet.com/~erin/anon.htm

God and the Soldier

God and the soldier
All men adore
In time of trouble,And no more;
For when war is over
And all things righted,
God is neglected--
The old soldier slighted.

http://www.dtic.mil/dpmo/newsre/1999/990917_senate_us_senator-cleland.htm

Remarks by Senator Max Cleland
POW/MIA Recognition Day Ceremony at
Arlington (Va.) National Cemetery
September 17, 1999:

'I was in Belgium, not long ago, and on the battlefield at Waterloo. After the battle, one of Wellington's troops wrote a friend and basically put it like this: "In times of war and not before, God and soldier men adore. But in times of peace with all things righted, God is forgotten and the soldier slighted."'

http://members.aol.com/cavsgt2107/quotes.html

"God and Soldier, all men adore,
In time of war, and nevermore.
In time of peace, when all is righted,
God is forgotten, and the Soldier slighted."

Found on a tombstone in a military
cemetary on Gibralter.

http://acam.ednet.ns.ca/curriculum/poetry.htm

"God and soldier all men adore,
In times of danger and not before.
When the danger is past and all things righted,
God is forgotten, and the old soldier slighted."
- Friar Tuck

http://tomallen.house.gov/showart.asp?contentID=474

Nearly four decades ago, President John F. Kennedy cautioned the graduating class at the U.S. Military Academy at West Point to expect ingratitude in times of peace. Quoting a poem found in an old sentry box in Gibraltar, he said: “‘God and the soldier all men adore, In times of trouble – and no more, For when war is over, and all things righted, God is neglected – and the soldier slighted.’”

http://www.virtualvegas.com/home_popunder_ext_flash.asp
God and Soldier

"God and the Soldier, all men adore
in time of strife,and not before.
When the danger is past, all wrongs arighted
God is forgotten the Old Soldier slighted."

by an anonymous soldier serving under the Duke of Marlborough, circa 1705

This one has the ring of veracity, though:

http://www.vbnhq.com/JDsBunker/ThanksSoldier.htm

Our God and soldier we alike adore Ev'n at the brink of danger; not before; After deliverance, both alike requited, Our God's forgotten, and our soldiers slighted. - Francis Quarles, 1632

I should probably get out more

Former Member · November 2002

Originally posted by Greenhat
What do you know, we agree on something

On many things, I shouldn't wonder. Just that I'm in the position to be a 'glass half full' kind of guy when it comes to assessing the human condition, something military types can't afford to be (or be seen to be, at any rate, unless they're name is Colin Powell

). It works both ways though, this liberal streak. My father, indigenous to Ireland, has contempt for anyone who joins the army, reasoning that only weak individuals knowingly subject themselves to the kind of mental ordeals required to make an effective warrior, one who will obey orders without question, maximising the prospect of a bloodless victory. I say, to no avail, that if such men are needed, and they obviously are (although I still object when they're employed to serve a country's economic interests rather than security), one shouldn't quibble over the methods of training when they do join up knowingly.

Former Member · November 2002

I'm a little surprised that man was able to smuggle in a knife to an El Al flight. For what I hear they have the strictest security measures in the world and endless searches before boarding the plane. Thankfully the man was quickly reduced.

Like others have said, there will always be attempts to hijack airplanes. At their present form they are an attractive option because of their vulnerable nature: self-contained, almost impossible to rush by security forces whether in the air or on land...

However security has overall improved enormously over the last 30 years. One has only have to look at news reports from the 70s to see there were hijacks every other week of the year.

Since the 9/11 atrocities our perception of damage limitation has obviously changed. In the past the safety of the passengers was the main concern. Now we must ensure that the cockpit stays out of bounds for any hijackers. If every passenger on the plane it's killed, it will unfortunately be a small price to pay compared with what could be done with control of the aircraft.

Former Member · November 2002

Originally posted by Aladdin
I'm a little surprised that man was able to smuggle in a knife to an El Al flight. For what I hear they have the strictest security measures in the world and endless searches before boarding the plane. Thankfully the man was quickly reduced.

Got told that the ways to smuggle things up the plane are unbeliavebly well-thought, and that people not dealing with this stuff would be amazed by the creativity, and sometimes pure simpleness wich goes into it.

I guess that, it's also easier when you know the procedure. Have flown with them for 16 years, and by now I know the line-up of questions, and what to answer to get less hassle. So it shouldn't be that hard for people with the wrong intentions to use this kind of info as well.

Thought it was over... Guess again

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