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Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
:eek: :eek: :eek:

Do I need to say more?

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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    If there is a hell, he will rot.

    My thoughts go out to the families and friends of the victims :(
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I was just wondering if someone could explain something which I have read but I don't really know much about.

    Wasn't he a drug addict at some point? And shouldn't the GMC have struck him off then? :confused:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Prodigous worker, Shipman but they to my mind don't seem the worst of murders, it's not like a child killer who robs the hope of a family. Some ppl might be secretly relieved , it's possible
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    He was prosecuted and convicted of forging prescriptions...God only knows why he was allowed to remain a doctor and to set up his own practice..
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    he's pure evil, no other words really to describe him:mad:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    apparently he has taken up boxing in prison :confused: He's believed to have a lethal jab

    *runs away and hides from abuse about to begin*
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Apparently the death toll has risen, 260 :eek:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by ebb
    apparently he has taken up boxing in prison :confused: He's believed to have a lethal jab

    LMAO :D

    As for his drug problem, yes he was a pethedine (heroin derivative) addict. Drug addiction doesn't mean a doctor is automatically struck off though.
    Originally posted by beeny:
    Shipman but they to my mind don't seem the worst of murders, it's not like a child killer who robs the hope of a family. Some ppl might be secretly relieved , it's possible

    Let's not justify what he did. There is no evidence that anyone of the 215 people he murdered (with 45 more "possibles") had any kind of life threatening condition, in fact most were perfectly healthy. Let me ask you this, would you "be secretly relieved" if he took your parents today? I doubt it.

    Most affected have said that they would expect to have their parents taken from them at some point, and there is always consolation in that, but the thought that they needn't have lost them yet must be hard to accept. Especially as there is no apparent motive.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Whowhere
    Apparently the death toll has risen, 260 :eek:

    What the inquiry concluded was that they were certain that he had killed 215 people, but that they weren't sure about another 45.

    Oh, and according to his wife, he didn't kill anyone. Talk about "stand by your man" :rolleyes:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Hes the most prolific killer, but hes certainly not the most evil. Myra Hindley and Rose West are easily 10 times worse...Im not justifing him, but he didnt really *hurt* anyone, morphine aint exactly a violent death. Rapists and child abusers are probably worse in the evil stakes than him, even though they didnt kill anyone. He wanted their money, so it was cold-blooded, callous, and evil, but he didnt hurt them phenomenally to get it.

    Not good in the slightest, and he should rot in jail forever, but everyone should atke a reality check and realise he certainly aint the worst guy to ever walk the earth.

    Let the flaming commence...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    would you "be secretly relieved" if he took your parents today? I doubt it.

    Yes, I don't like them
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Oh, and I love the Weezer quote MoK:)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by beeny
    Yes, I don't like them

    Cant argue with logic like that :rolleyes:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Kermit


    Cant argue with logic like that :rolleyes:

    You mean - can't argue with a twat like that. :rolleyes:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Of course he is just as bad as the other mass murderers, mainly due to the sheer quantity of people he killed. All those families left behind, its them who suffer whether the death was violent or not, the fact is it wasnt mercy killings for a lot of them, they had gone to the doctor for simple things, and he had killed them by overdose.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Now that this "who is the most evil" subject has been brought up, does anyone else have the feeling that the tabloids are not giving Shipman the same 'preferential' treatment as that given to, say, the Moors killers or a paedophile? Sure, now that the inquiry has been published all the papers are reporting it at length. But try to compare the column inches devoted by The Sun and News of the World to date to the murder of Sarah Payne by a paedophile, and the column inches devoted to Shipman's murders. Or try to imagine the Mirror running 8-10 stories a year on Shipman in twenty-five years time (which is what they're doing with Myra Hendley). Very unlikely.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Shipman isnt seen as 'bad' as other serial killers because he wasnt brutal. He slowly and 'kindly' put those people to sleep, they didnt suffer, they werent raped, mutialted, beaten or tortured.

    That doesnt make what he did any more acceptable, it just explains why hes not seen as such a monster by some people..

    Aladdin, i dunno which papers youve been reading mate but Shipman was in the papers a huge amount when this story first came out. The reason it slowed down for a while was because we were awaiting confirmation of the investigations...Hes been all over the papers the last week or so....If theres a campaign to have him released then I guarantee you that he will be in the news as much, but probably a lot more, than hyndley.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by rainbow brite
    Of course he is just as bad as the other mass murderers, mainly due to the sheer quantity of people he killed. All those families left behind, its them who suffer whether the death was violent or not, the fact is it wasnt mercy killings for a lot of them, they had gone to the doctor for simple things, and he had killed them by overdose.


    Only one other person in the last few hundred years has killed more people, some guy from Mexico who strangled 300 young girls in the 1980's.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Balddog
    Shipman isnt seen as 'bad' as other serial killers because he wasnt brutal. He slowly and 'kindly' put those people to sleep, they didnt suffer, they werent raped, mutialted, beaten or tortured.

    .
    Most of them werent even ill though, theyd called him in for minor complaints, Its not exactly kind is it? its not the same as euthanasia for terminal illnesses. In some ways it makes even less sense because of the way he did it.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by rainbow brite

    Most of them werent even ill though, theyd called him in for minor complaints, Its not exactly kind is it? its not the same as euthanasia for terminal illnesses. In some ways it makes even less sense because of the way he did it.

    Yeah well, thats why i put it in inverted commas...The method he used was kind. He didnt use violence and he would have been talking kindly to them as they let him inject them without putting up a fight. Kind as in method, not motive.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by J
    either he was born a killer
    Originally posted by J

    As I've said before, we’re a blank canvas when we are born.

    :confused:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    People arent a blank canvas, all people are different and have different abilities, dispositions, etc. thats why so many health problems, including mental health problems, are genetic...depression is one of the main mental illnesses which run in families.

    Not everyone can be a supermodel, footballer, lawyer, scientist...its as much down to genetics as upbringing. After all, a child born with no legs isnt the same as a person with a fully-functional body.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I was going to bring up the blank canvas thing too, because there have been plenty of studies of twins seperated at birth, yet still having remarkably similar lives, to say that people are not just blank canvasses at birth.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I agree with you to an extent, it is a mixture of nature and nurture which makes a personality. All I was saying is that we are not a blank canvas at birth, nature does come into it too, although theres no doubt that upbringing does play a huge part.
    Its futile to ry and work out what makes someone kill again and again, you cant start blaming others for behaviour like that.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by J
    Society/life has done something to him that has made him murder 200 people. You can't deny it.
    Unfortunately things will get worse as people try to clean up the mess as opposed to tackling the cause.

    It is believed that watching his Mum die a slow painful death through cancer is what triggered his actions. "Experts" who have reviewed the case believe he didn't want to see other people suffer and felt that involuntary euthanasia was a way of preventing that.

    You can't put that down to society.

    More a case of life giving a harsh lesson and him not reacting well.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I see what your saying J, maybe he was messed up in the head, but that doesn't make his actions anymore justifiable or acceptable, he wasn't an idiot, he was a doctor and certainly knew right from wrong.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by ebb
    I see what your saying J, maybe he was messed up in the head, but that doesn't make his actions anymore justifiable or acceptable, he wasn't an idiot, he was a doctor and certainly knew right from wrong.

    Did he? There are some people who are genuinely amoral, i.e. have no concepts of right and wrong. In fact, head down to your nearest pit of poverty and you will find countless specimens of H. sapiens with varying degrees of amorality. Not immorality, but amorality. Moreover, even if Shipman did have a moral code, who is to say that it was the same as yours or mine? Someone can do wrong and believe him/herself to be doing right, you know.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Zackly Mackenzie, as MoK suggests he probably thought he was saving people from a horrible death by killing them with a dose of morphine, which isnt a nice way to go but its better than dying of cancer.

    Peoples moral codes come from social conditioning, and if an event messes up that social conditioning then his moral code will be different too. Thats why so many people thieve, rape and murder...a lot of them think its ok. Thats why so many abused children go on to abuse their own children.
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