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Let's talk about it: Current issue

Salix_alba_2019Salix_alba_2019 Posts: 1,282 Wise Owl
I'm sure that many of you have been hearing about what's going on in response to George Floyds death. I wanted to create a space where people could ask questions about things surrounding the matter. 


CalebMikeGreenTea

Comments

  • independent_independent_ Resident Coffee Addict ScotlandPosts: 6,518 Master Poster
    This is a really good idea Salix, great to get people talking about it :)
    “Sometimes the people around you won’t understand your journey. They don’t need to, it’s not for them.”
    Salix_alba_2019
  • MikeMike 🖥️🎧 LandaanPosts: 3,470 Community Manager
    edited June 2020
    Safe spaces to talk/ask about these things are really important - good shout. :)

    I don't know if this is the sort of question you had in mind Salix, and obviously nobody speaks for an entire social group, but I'm wondering: what's helpful/unhelpful for allies to be doing right now?

    Edit: to clarify, this is aimed at anyone who has that awareness; not just you @Salix_alba_2019!
    All behaviour is a need trying to be met.

    Want to join the community champions? Drop @TheMix a message!
  • GreenTeaGreenTea ☕🌻☕ MidlandsPosts: 11,153 An Original Mixlorian
    edited June 2020
    Just a PSA:

    If you choose to protest, as many of them are happening across the UK, please remember and be mindful that covid is still a threat. Please try to social distance, stay hydrated etc. 
    If you are showing symptoms of the virus. Please do not attend a protest! There are many other ways your voice can be heard:

    - Sign the petition!!
    - use social media as a platform to raise your voice!

    Please look after yourselves. You are all important 💕




    (If this isn't ok to post, please remove it. If anything needs to be added, you are more than welcome to ask the mods on @The Mix to edit it

    The scars you can't see are the hardest to heal.     

    Astrid Alauda

    Salix_alba_2019Mikeindependent_Dandelion
  • Salix_alba_2019Salix_alba_2019 Posts: 1,282 Wise Owl
    I believe that education is key and people are more receptive to receive information if it's one achieved through conversations :)


    @GreenTea you're absolutely right

    @Mike that's a really good question. Right now I believe the best thing allies can do is what @GreenTea has mentioned above and to have those difficult conversations with other non people of colour :) 
    Mike
  • ShaunieShaunie 🌸 Posts: 12,653 Born on Earth, Raised by The Mix
    edited June 2020
    Good thread idea!
    Post edited by Shaunie on
    .
  • GreenTeaGreenTea ☕🌻☕ MidlandsPosts: 11,153 An Original Mixlorian
    I believe that education is key and people are more receptive to receive information if it's one achieved through conversations :)


    @GreenTea you're absolutely right

    @Mike that's a really good question. Right now I believe the best thing allies can do is what @GreenTea has mentioned above and to have those difficult conversations with other non people of colour :) 

    I really agree on the education is key with all this!

    The scars you can't see are the hardest to heal.     

    Astrid Alauda

  • Millie2787Millie2787 🐶 💜 Posts: 3,921 Community Veteran
    I’m not going to lie I do t really know much about everything g that’s going I. , obviously I now what happens to George floydd but beyond that I’m not quite so sure. It’s not that I don’t want to learn about it but hearing and reading about how violent some of these protests can end up I. Makes me quite anxious so I naturally avoid it , I know that majority of the all the protests aren’t Violent but it seems that the news just keep focusing on the violent ones which naturally I’m going to avoid reading about as they make me quiet anxious and upset.

    Is love to learn more about what’s going on right now but yeah I’m. It sure now is the right time for me.
    Sometimes all you need is one person to believe in you , for you to begin to believe in yourself.
    Mikeindependent_
  • Salix_alba_2019Salix_alba_2019 Posts: 1,282 Wise Owl
    Don't be scared this platform is here so that you can ask questions so that others can explain things to aid in understanding.

    The problem here is the use of excessive force on an innocent black man.

    There are people in the world who have a superioty complex against minorities that use the police uniform to carry out these atrocities with no repercussions because the police force allows it. The foundations of the the US law and inforcement were founded on white supremacy. Once apon a time slave owners created the police force to go out and bring back runaway slaves that would later be subjected to violence. So this means that a person in a police uniform can abuse their power to target minorities and get away with it. The racist ideologies are still things which excist in the the force which why statistically speaking black people are more likely to be subjected to brutality from police compared to their white counter parts. Making George's case racially motivated and classified as modern day lynching. 

    Mike
  • MikeMike 🖥️🎧 LandaanPosts: 3,470 Community Manager
    edited June 2020
    @Mike that's a really good question. Right now I believe the best thing allies can do is what @GreenTea has mentioned above and to have those difficult conversations with other non people of colour :) 
    Makes a lot of sense @Salix_alba_2019 and @GreenTea. There's definitely value in challenging people on problematic views, especially if you're coming from a position of privilege, and being able able to have difficult conversations with people in an educational and non-hostile way.

    @Shaunie, I wonder if it's a case of looking at wider statistics and thinking about racism in a different way? The way police treat black people in the US has been an ongoing problem for a long time and when you look at the patterns, the testimonials from people who have experienced this stuff, or even bodycam footage from police, it starts to look pretty clear that this is a racist issue. Maybe not always as simple as a police officer saying 'I hate black people', but in a systemic way - the way police are trained, the lack of accountability for police in the US, etc. You can even see it in the statistics for how often black people are stopped in their cars compared to white people. It boggles the mind.

    Fair doos @Millie2787 - it's frustrating when the media focus on feeding the fear around this stuff rather than running pieces that try to empathise with the positions protestors are in or inform people.
    All behaviour is a need trying to be met.

    Want to join the community champions? Drop @TheMix a message!
  • ShaunieShaunie 🌸 Posts: 12,653 Born on Earth, Raised by The Mix
    Im sorry i did edit over cause got scared ah. But thank you @Mike @Salix_alba_2019 makes more sense now. Thank you
    .
  • independent_independent_ Resident Coffee Addict ScotlandPosts: 6,518 Master Poster
    I agree with @Millie2787 sometimes reading about the violence is really horrible so it’s good to have this thread to read the answers to others questions on it.
    “Sometimes the people around you won’t understand your journey. They don’t need to, it’s not for them.”
  • Salix_alba_2019Salix_alba_2019 Posts: 1,282 Wise Owl
    @Millie2787 that's completely understandable and scary, your concerns are valid

    I've seen innocent children, medics, and news reporters get hit with rubber bullets and tear gas. The rubber bullets are huge, they are not meant for the head yet multiple people have been subjected to it by police. On TikTok a lot of people have caught officers committing war crimes and inexcusable actions. 

    When you see those people rioting that is all the pent up hurt and anguish coming out. That all those times they were discriminated against and moved on because they had no choice. Those are people who felt George's pain as he cried for his mum before taking his last breath. These people are vulnerable and these are people who are being antagonised and treated unfairly by the very people that are meant to protect and serve them.

    It's a very scary time, it's very distressing 


    @Mike Absolutely, racism is always as overt as using the N word. Racisms comes in many forms to show a person of colour that there is a lack of respect.


  • AidanAidan Clever idiot Posts: 3,017 Boards Guru
    There's a Nelson Mandela quote for everything it seems:

    “When a man is denied the right to live the life he believes in, he has no choice but to become an outlaw.”



    but idk tho
    independent_
  • AidanAidan Clever idiot Posts: 3,017 Boards Guru
    edited June 2020

    “No one is born hating another person because of the color of his skin, or his background, or his religion. People must learn to hate, and if they can learn to hate, they can be taught to love, for love comes more naturally to the human heart than its opposite.”

    but idk tho
    independent_
  • Salix_alba_2019Salix_alba_2019 Posts: 1,282 Wise Owl
    Aidan said:

    “No one is born hating another person because of the color of his skin, or his background, or his religion. People must learn to hate, and if they can learn to hate, they can be taught to love, for love comes more naturally to the human heart than its opposite.”

    This is absolutely true. My SO is white and so is the rest of his family. His neice just turned two and she absolutely adores me. When she's out the pram and walking she is adamant that she doesn't want to hold anyone's hand but mine. She brings all her toys to play with me when she doesn't even do this for her own uncle 💀
  • Salix_alba_2019Salix_alba_2019 Posts: 1,282 Wise Owl
    Right, I want everyone to have a quick google search and answer the following questions.

    Why is saying all lives matter is problematic and what does it really mean?

    what copaganda and how does the media use this in damaging ways?
    Toni
  • AidanAidan Clever idiot Posts: 3,017 Boards Guru
    All lives do matter, but the movement of ‘all lives matter’ denies racism. All lives won’t matter until black lives and other minorities' lives matter.

    Propaganda is misinformation (though not always blatant lies, it might be a spin on the truth or facts given out of proper context) which the media uses to express their own views according to their own bias.
    E.g. in the UK The Daily Mail has a right-wing bias, and The Daily Mirror has a left-wing bias. 
    but idk tho
    Salix_alba_2019
  • Salix_alba_2019Salix_alba_2019 Posts: 1,282 Wise Owl
    @Aidan

    you're absolutely right about the first one, I just wanted pop in real quick to tell you that "propaganda" was a typo ;)
  • AidanAidan Clever idiot Posts: 3,017 Boards Guru
    Oohhhh, it's like cop propoganda

    My favourite example:


    but idk tho
  • ShaunieShaunie 🌸 Posts: 12,653 Born on Earth, Raised by The Mix
    Why is saying all lives matter is problematic and what does it really mean?

    .
  • BenMaBenMa Posts: 57 Boards Initiate
    Sadly, the phrase 'All Lives Matter' takes away from the fact that racism exists and still has a (fatal) impact on people of colour.

    In my mind, it's the equivalent of having a 'Straight Pride' - because it takes away from the fact that people in the LGBTQ+ still experience homophobia.

    All lives won't matter until black lives matter, and for that to happen everyone needs to chip in to contribute towards the positive social changes.

    I hope everyone is having a good morning!
    Children, after all, are not just adults-in-the-making. They are people whose current needs and rights and experiences must be taken seriously. – Alfie Kohn
    chubbydumpling
  • AidanAidan Clever idiot Posts: 3,017 Boards Guru
    I have made a quick quiz to help you find out if racial equality will be good for you!

    Question 1: do you have a race?

    If your answer to question 1 is 'yes', racial equality is good for you.


    but idk tho
  • AzzimanAzziman The Mix convert Posts: 980 You're a wizard, Harry
    My worry about these protests is whether they will actually amount to any change. Historically, protests succeed when the authority is open to the protestor claims, and it doesn't look like the American government is really open to that. Especially when you consider the small group of violent actors that the media focus on, that works against any hope of change considerably more. This is not the first protest for BLM, and likely not the last, but I do worry that we're going to have this same conversation again and again without anything actually changing. This is partly why people lose hope in politics - when you're having the same debate and conversation over and over without anything changing. Hopefully they can achieve change though x
  • AidanAidan Clever idiot Posts: 3,017 Boards Guru
    I know this is a place for questions, and we're supposed to be having difficult conversations- no offense intended (I'm curious about what good answers there are that I'm not seeing because of my different background :) ): 

    • Could protesting saying 'black lives matter', when it's so dangerous for POC to crowd because of coronavirus (or anybody, but POC 2x more so according to a review), be sending the opposite message unintentionally?

    • Could the violence and death- which the media is always quick to report on even if the majority of protesters are peaceful- be having consequences in reaffirming misconceptions and prejudices about POC and crime?

    • Do you think things will change? Either in the US, the UK, or the world as a whole?
    but idk tho
  • Salix_alba_2019Salix_alba_2019 Posts: 1,282 Wise Owl
    Azziman said:
    My worry about these protests is whether they will actually amount to any change. Historically, protests succeed when the authority is open to the protestor claims, and it doesn't look like the American government is really open to that. Especially when you consider the small group of violent actors that the media focus on, that works against any hope of change considerably more. This is not the first protest for BLM, and likely not the last, but I do worry that we're going to have this same conversation again and again without anything actually changing. This is partly why people lose hope in politics - when you're having the same debate and conversation over and over without anything changing. Hopefully they can achieve change though x
    @Azziman

    Pssssssp it's working 


    Azziman
  • Salix_alba_2019Salix_alba_2019 Posts: 1,282 Wise Owl

    Ello @Aidan honestly there's no offence taken, feel free to ask anytime

    - Yes, especially if protesting is not done the right way. I've seen a few and attended one that handed out masks to those who didn't have one and distributed hand sanitizer. Believe me they are encouraged to social distance and reminded that COVID is still around. 

    -Absolutely! As POC  the stereotypes haunt us all and I know this from having first hand experience after moving to a predominantly white area to study my degree. It's amazing seeing people's tone and attitude shift when they hear me speak and find out what I study 🥴

    -seeing the worldwide protests and support of the movement I beleive that things will change and have changed. I've seen some amazing suggestions in terms of education, designation of money and sanctions of people in the police who abuse their positions. 

    Check this out 


  • Millie2787Millie2787 🐶 💜 Posts: 3,921 Community Veteran
    I was unsure how I could help ... I wanted to go to protests but I have a massive anxiety and fear of large groups so I did some research  and ordered from a small business who is donating part of the product price to a POC charity. 
    Sometimes all you need is one person to believe in you , for you to begin to believe in yourself.
    Past UserSalix_alba_2019PoppyB
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