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The BNP - they hate it, it's safe to say...

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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    the kid in the polo did a nice job of ducking that first right hook.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Plus public services have to increase at a rate commensurate with the rate of net immigration. More people doesn't necessarily equate to more tax revenue.

    I was wondering why no-one has questioned the LibDems frankly insane policy of trying to make immigrants go to areas where they're needed. I mean, I know our public transport system is pretty crap, but I'm fairly sure trains still run, thus enabling free movement of labour. Old Cleggy clearly didn't think that one through.

    If you need a signed work permit for a job and the work permit says valid only in certain regions then it might be tricky getting work. Though I'm sure a lot of people would work cash in hand.



    Also, with regard to the criticisms of my more people > more tax > more service, you're right, but my intention was to point out to Goldsmith that it's not black/white that immigration is a 'bad' thing and we should put into perspective that pretty much all the political parties look on it as a bad thing. We've had specialists coming from all over the world to live and work here for generations - who hasn't had a doctor or nurse who isn't from British origin?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Whilst an ok idea in theory, think about it for more than 10 seconds and the practical implementation of it in a way that actually works quickly becomes impossible.

    SB, no it is not a black and white issue (unless you're Nick Griffin, bu-dum). However that works both ways. Immigration is not necessarily bad when it brings skills that society needs. Nor is it necessarily good when it's unfettered and uncontrolled. Up until recently, I would have probably been decried as an enemy of the people for such a sentiment...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    ShyBoy wrote: »
    More people = more tax = more money to boost services.
    Really? More tax is dependent on more people actually having a job so that they can pay the aforementioned tax. And in case you haven't noticed, we're in a massive recession right now. There's around two and a half million officially unemployed, and the number of people who are leaving work altogether is rocketing. The number who are classed as "economically inactive" is now as high as eight million, according to some studies.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Work by the Institute for Public Policy Research (IPPR) found that migration has a positive and growing impact on the public finances. By 2003-04 it was estimated that migrants contributed 10 percent of government receipts and accounted for 9.1 per cent of government expenditure.

    Reed, H. and Latorre, M. (2009) The Economic Impacts of Migration on the UK Labour Market. http://www.ippr.org.uk/publicationsandreports/publication.asp?id=649
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    MoK wrote: »
    Work by the Institute for Public Policy Research (IPPR) found that migration has a positive and growing impact on the public finances. By 2003-04 it was estimated that migrants contributed 10 percent of government receipts and accounted for 9.1 per cent of government expenditure.

    Reed, H. and Latorre, M. (2009) The Economic Impacts of Migration on the UK Labour Market. http://www.ippr.org.uk/publicationsandreports/publication.asp?id=649

    It's probably worth noting that a very small percentage accounts for that 10%, namely the multi-billionaires. Most migrants are cost neutral and a few are very expensive

    It also worth saying that there's different migration patterns, East Europeans will typically come here for a certain number of years and have no intention of retiring in the UK (and to a lesser extent leave before their children become of school age). The same isn't true for immigrants from the Indian Sub-continent who mainly come for full-time settlement. The costs and benefits will be different

    The costs and benefits are also inequally spread. Wealthy business owners benefit from cheaper wages (which may be good as they can then invest more and pay more in tax), but it drives down or at least stabilises the wages of the low paid. A cynic might say that why immigration is more popular in Hampstead than Burnley
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    As an aside, can we all be delighted by the fact that the BNP lost all their seats on Barking council.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    MoK wrote: »
    As an aside, can we all be delighted by the fact that the BNP lost all their seats on Barking council.

    :yes:

    My cat is from Dagenham.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    stargalaxy wrote: »
    Really? More tax is dependent on more people actually having a job so that they can pay the aforementioned tax. And in case you haven't noticed, we're in a massive recession right now. There's around two and a half million officially unemployed, and the number of people who are leaving work altogether is rocketing. The number who are classed as "economically inactive" is now as high as eight million, according to some studies.

    Way to read subsequent posts :thumb:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    MoK wrote: »
    As an aside, can we all be delighted by the fact that the BNP lost all their seats on Barking council.

    They've lost 22 of their 36 councillors altogether. :thumb: Just 14 left. Kicked out of Solihull. Kicked out of Leeds. Kicked out of Sandwell. Cut from 9 to 4 in Stoke (7 to 4 actually, because 2 were defections). And I've read that it's cost them £130,000 in lost deposits.

    Interestingly, the local elections haven't been reported a lot, but Labour have gained massively, with every other party losing. 11 new councils and 249 extra councillors.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Interestingly, the local elections haven't been reported a lot, but Labour have gained massively, with every other party losing. 11 new councils and 249 extra councillors.

    Not surprising - they lost a lot because they're voters didn't come out at previous council elections or cast a protest vote, they were about as low as they were going to go. Compared to recent council elections there share of the vote is up
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Those young asians in Romford shouldn't have responded to the provocation. By the way it was also a stupid thing for the BNP canvasers to say as you shouldn't go asking for trouble.
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