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Kevin Spacey vs. The BBC

Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
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Actor and theatre director Kevin Spacey has criticised the BBC for airing talent shows such as Any Dream Will Do and I'd Do Anything.

"I felt that was essentially a 13-week promotion for a musical - where's our 13-week programme?" Spacey said.

Putting aside any opinions about public service broadcasting in general for a second, do these programmes effectively constitute free advertising, and should the BBC allow such programmes? I can see the difference between this and a quick plug on a chat show, but is it much different from something like Fame Academy, where presumably the BBC didn't hold the rights to the performers either?

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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Methinks Mr Spacey is jealous.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    stargalaxy wrote: »
    Methinks Mr Spacey is jealous.


    Of course he is, the bbc is giving free promotion, through our tax payers money to a show

    stargalaxy, all the times you rant about mispent public money, you of all should be annoyed by it.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    stargalaxy wrote: »
    Methinks Mr Spacey is jealous.

    Methinks he is spot on.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    He does have a point. Even if the BBC does not have any commercial interests from the future West End production, it does give it a nice (and massive) advertising promotion.

    If they'd just limited their collaboration with Webber to one show, and then done the next one with a different production company you could at least argue others in theatreland would benefit. But Webber seems to be getting all the attention and all the benefits.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    MrG wrote: »
    stargalaxy, all the times you rant about mispent public money, you of all should be annoyed by it.
    I really couldn't care less about it.
    Aladdin wrote: »
    If they'd just limited their collaboration with Webber to one show, and then done the next one with a different production company you could at least argue others in theatreland would benefit. But Webber seems to be getting all the attention and all the benefits.
    It might be worth pointing out here that Webber doesn't have an exclusive contract with the Beeb about this. According to rumours in media land, he's been talking to ITV about them making similar shows regarding the play Oliver!.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    kevin spacey is hot :yes:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    So SG, how can you not care less about this, then go off on one about MP's expenses?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    stargalaxy wrote: »
    It might be worth pointing out here that Webber doesn't have an exclusive contract with the Beeb about this. According to rumours in media land, he's been talking to ITV about them making similar shows regarding the play Oliver!.

    Exclusive in the sense that only his play is mentioned (actually, the Oliver play isn't his, but it's still 13 weeks dedicated to a single play). Something like Top of the Pops promotes bands, but it doesn't exclusively promote the bands of a single record company.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Nah, the Oliver one has already been bought by the Beeb and is already in the second week (as mentioned in the article) - they are going to select an Oliver (who won't be voted on due to the actor's age) and a nancy by public vote.

    Although -

    'Oliver! is being produced by Sir Cameron Mackintosh, though Lord Lloyd-Webber remains on the judging panel.'

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/oliver/

    To be frank I fully agree with the idea of bringing back the Wednesday Play - I can't think of any significant British playwright or television writer of note who didn't get their start with a quick hour play on the Beeb (Potter, Loach, Leigh, etc).

    It's about time the BBC stopped chasing ratings and started to invest in the talent in the UK, and I don't mean a couple of graduate schemes or a one off competition that gets the winner a 10 minute drama aired at 3am. America's current high quality TV production, at least over the last 10 years, is due to a massive focus on the value of writers.

    The Beeb should be at the very center of developing new and significant talent that pushes the envelope of television and especially documentary and drama - not running around with a hidden camera watching a fucking goalkeeper skate badly whilst being serenaded by a 17 year old drama school protegé dressed as an Austrian pickpocket.

    It's nice to see the shite on ITV do badly but it's a hollow victory if to do it the BBC and Channel 4 surrender everything that made them worthwhile.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Sorry just mentioned two directors and only one writer in the example - but to make the point here's the quick summary of some of the talent involved in the Play for Today (The long running follow-up to the original Wednesday Play) from the real height of the Beeb's drama output (and let's not forget Dr. Who was able to put out some of it's best ever stuff in exactly the same period)
    Writers who contributed plays to the series included John Osborne, Dennis Potter, Stephen Poliakoff, David Hare, Willy Russell, Alan Bleasdale, Arthur Hopcraft, Alan Plater, Graham Reid, David Storey, and John Hopkins. Several prominent directors also featured, including Stephen Frears, Alan Clarke, Michael Apted, Mike Newell, Roland Joffe, Ken Loach, Lindsay Anderson, and Mike Leigh.

    From - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Play_for_Today
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Exclusive in the sense that only his play is mentioned (actually, the Oliver play isn't his, but it's still 13 weeks dedicated to a single play). Something like Top of the Pops promotes bands, but it doesn't exclusively promote the bands of a single record company.
    Breaking news - Top of the Pops went off the air around two years ago. :p
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    stargalaxy wrote: »
    Breaking news - Top of the Pops went off the air around two years ago. :p

    Still a valid example though.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Plus it's on at Christmas anyway. :p
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    kevin spacey is hot :yes:

    TBH if the rumours are true then I stand more chance than you do ;)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I think Spacey has a fair point. But only because I think those talent shows are the most aggravating thing on tv.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Of course he's right. I don't necessarily think the BBC are doing this for any ulterior reason, more that Lloyd-Webber's musicals are the only ones people have heard of. People won't watch a programme about a play they don't know about. But it is affecting the takings of other plays and the BBC is using its power to skew commercial productions.

    It should be acting in a more generalist sense to further the arts and drama. The Play of the Day would be a good start. Much better than another repeat of sodding Weakest Link.

    I think the BBC uses its monopoly status to put commercial broadcasters out of business all too often, but for once it's not.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Jim V wrote: »
    Sorry just mentioned two directors and only one writer in the example - but to make the point here's the quick summary of some of the talent involved in the Play for Today (The long running follow-up to the original Wednesday Play) from the real height of the Beeb's drama output (and let's not forget Dr. Who was able to put out some of it's best ever stuff in exactly the same period)



    From - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Play_for_Today

    The continuing impact of Play For Today can be seen here: http://www.bfi.org.uk/features/tv/100/biglist/drama_single.html

    Amazing how many on this list are from that series. Even more amazing to think that ITV used to produce serious plays.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Its not really that it just focuses on Webber that gets to me, its the fact that all these talent shows are all exactly the same and are all crap.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I've read that these programmes promote the whole idea of going to the theatre for live entertainment and people are wanting to go to the theatre more as a result so if that was true then other shows would still be benefitting from them.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Methinks he is spot on.
    Superman will stop him...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    budda wrote: »
    Its not really that it just focuses on Webber that gets to me, its the fact that all these talent shows are all exactly the same and are all crap.

    :yes:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    budda wrote: »
    Its not really that it just focuses on Webber that gets to me, its the fact that all these talent shows are all exactly the same and are all crap.

    Strongly agree. The amount of aural and visual detritus that spews forth from The Idiot Box at the moment is dia-fucking-bolical; it's mind-rot television of the highest order.

    Some of the shows T4 put out quite literally make me feel sick. There seems to be an equation that TV show producers appear to be adhering to currently: attractiveness x stupidity = chance of being on TV.

    Wow. I didn't realise how strongly i felt about it till it wrote that. :D
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Strongly agree. The amount of aural and visual detritus that spews forth from The Idiot Box at the moment is dia-fucking-bolical; it's mind-rot television of the highest order.

    I have fancy pants cable TV and still there is only 1 or 2 shows a day worth bothering with.

    Having said that though BBC4 has been putting out some good shows about advertising recently.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    budda wrote: »
    Having said that though BBC4 has been putting out some good shows about advertising recently.
    Have you been watching A Year In Tibet recently? Awesome programme. But it's got subtitles, so it has to go on BBC4 at 2 in the morning. :rolleyes:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Have you been watching A Year In Tibet recently? Awesome programme. But it's got subtitles, so it has to go on BBC4 at 2 in the morning. :rolleyes:

    I havent, but I thought that was on in the evenings. I'll keep my eyes open for it.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    It's on tonight, I think. It's on iPlayer too.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I've been watching A Year in Tibet. Fascinating stuff.

    I also thought No. 1. Ladies' Detective Agency starring Jill Scott was brilliant. So the BBC ain't all bad.

    But yeah, T.V. talent shows are a load of twaddle in general, though I totally agree with Kevin Spacey's comments.
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