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I don't - as we saw the train stayed well intact, so the major injuries are likely to be people flying forward, hitting tables, smashing into the seat infront of them, etc
It's not exactly difficult to have 3 point safety belts on trains and give people the option of using them or not. I'm sure people with young kids would have liked the option
If you strapped most of those people to their seats I'm sure they'd have been even fewer injuries.
Possibly, but what I meant was that the large size of the train coupled with its massive momentum ( so less impacted G-force for deceleration) along with the compartmentalizism from the high seats means that the idea is that the passengers are safe enough without them. I guess people have done studies and such on this.
You call it "luck", I call it a testament to modern engineering.
Seat belts are not really necessary on trains, as the seats are designed to prevent people flying about. It isn't like in a car or coach where you will be thrown out of the window if it crashes because of the sudden g-forces. Perhaps seatbelts may save a few minor injuries, but seatbelts don't really tend to save lives in something as big as a train.
Seat belts in cars stop you going through the windscreen, stop you slamming into the person in front, and keep you inside the vehicle.
Trains don't have windscreens as far as passengers are concerned, the seats stop you slamming into the back of the person infront because they are so much stronger than car seats, and the frame keeps you inside the vehicle.
Think about planes (which are probably the closest comparison), the seat belts on those only hold you down into your seat which stops you getting a battered arse and bruised coccyx in case of turbulence.
What stops people slamming into the tables inbetween some seats?
It's very short sighted to think companies and governments place safety as the number 1 priority in everything, if they did then cigarettes would have been banned long ago. Life is about balance. If safety was the only concern then there's no way you'd be allowed to buy duty free alcohol on board an airplane. Seeing also alcohol is highly flammable .. but the money it help raise boosts the airline's profits and to some extent help offset higher airfares.
if safety was taken to the extreme then all the seats on both planes and trains would face backwards to minimise injuries.
Nothing stops people slamming into the tables, you're right.
Everything is relative, while planes run on Jet Fuel the flammable properties of the alcohol on board are totally irrelevant. When a plane goes bang it's the jet fuel and more significantly the jet fuel vapours in the part empty fuel tanks. That amount of alcohol will make naff all difference.
If safety was taken to the extreme we'd get rid of all cars too, but instead we take reasonable measures and live a reasonable life where we assess risk and take sensible precautions.
True.
They are however designed to shatter and break in case of a severe impact. The seat design is important too - the seats are designed to keep you more in place - so you stay away from tables etc in the first place.
sorry but you're not correct about the duty free..
Actually the alcohol content onboard in people's duty free can make a huge difference
I refer you to the following link from the NTSB who investigated the crash of Korean Airlines in Guam
http://www.ntsb.gov/Events/kal801/Exhibits/Ex_16C.pdf
Interviews of survivors, especially that of one Barry Small (a Helicopter pilot), indicate that a fireball blew through the cabin of the aircraft upon impact. Mr. Small surmises that the fireball was fueled by oxygen from the emergency canisters and by alcohol from duty free liquor onboard.
It isn't just the AMOUNT of alcohol it's where it's located inside, in the cabin with the passengers and all those glass bottles smash in a crash spilling alcohol all over the seats, passengers, etc
One thing that could be done however is for airport dutyfree to be supplied in non glass containers. The same way many nightclubs now source popular drinks in plastic rather then glass bottles.
As selfish as this sounds, I hope its all sorted by Tuesday. I'm supposed to be going Huddersfield Tuesday night and I need to get a train home on Friday evening (but I think they will be sorted by Friday!)
Poo.
None of the train times were up and there was no trains about so I don't know whats going on
The train station was empty though and none of the departure times were up on the board. It just concerned me a little.
You are right in saying that normaly the trains momentum will limit the deceleration g-forces (however this is not always true; e.g. the ICE crash in Germany where the train hit a bridge). But this is only usefull if the train stays upright and doesn't spin. However if the train comes off the track and rolls then seat belts will save lifes and reduce injuries.
Also if a post crash fire were to occur, then having a non-life treathing injury (e.g. boken leg) could turn a surviable crash into one which isn't. So anything which could reduce more minor injuries can make a big difference.
The same argument was about not needing seats belts was made about busses for years. Where as now most new coaches are fitted with them after a number of high profile crashes.
However the thing that scares me more than anything else, when traveling by trains is seeing people putting heavy bags on the over head luggage rack. Even heavy breaking can make them fall onto people, I'd hate to think of that would happen in a crash.
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William.
In planes you have weight issues, in Cars you have seats that need to go back and forth to adjust for different drivers leg lengths.
In trains you have none of these issues, the only issue you really have is that in trains you also have standing passengers and having seatbelts in trains suddenly means standing passengers are much less protected in a crash then those seated. The train companies may their real money from peak hour travellers, many of who will have no chance of ever getting a seat in the morning and after work.
If you want to read more about seatbelts on trains see this
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/devon/4076007.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/berkshire/6120362.stm