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Monty Monty Panesar!

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  • littlemissylittlemissy knit chick Posts: 9,972
    2009 actually.
    Yeah, I meant next time :p

    It was early :(
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Well that was an Ashes to remember!

    The Curse of Sky strikes again.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    We won with a whitewash :hyper:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    "He gets too emotional and that will affect his tactical judgements"
    WTF??
    Only just realised that this comment was directed at what I said. I think that you'll find that I justified my comment. I made it clear that in no way did I think that Freddie was at fault BUT that as such a major part of the team (being an all rounder) he should be able to focus on his game rather than that of everyone else.

    I can't be bothered to justify this further as it's all over now. Never mind. I would like to say that I enjoyed watching it but as it was on in the middle of the night I hardly saw any of it. I'll get to see our lovely boys later this year though.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Loopi wrote:
    Only just realised that this comment was directed at what I said. I think that you'll find that I justified my comment. I made it clear that in no way did I think that Freddie was at fault BUT that as such a major part of the team (being an all rounder) he should be able to focus on his game rather than that of everyone else.

    I can't be bothered to justify this further as it's all over now. Never mind. I would like to say that I enjoyed watching it but as it was on in the middle of the night I hardly saw any of it. I'll get to see our lovely boys later this year though.

    You were right in what you said anyway. Vaughn is able to captain without his ego or his emotions getting in the way. Freddie aint...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kermit wrote:
    We won with a whitewash :hyper:

    "We"? :mad: ;)
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    "We"? :mad: ;)

    The wonders of dual citizenship mean that my team never loses :lol:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kermit wrote:
    The wonders of dual citizenship mean that my team never loses :lol:

    When it comes to footie, well you're fooked then.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Yerascrote wrote:
    When it comes to footie, well you're fooked then.

    probably still better off sticking with australia there as well, these days.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Addict wrote:
    probably still better off sticking with australia there as well, these days.

    Haha I was actually gonna write that too.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Yerascrote wrote:
    When it comes to footie, well you're fooked then.

    Except they beat us last time we played :(
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kermit wrote:
    We won with a whitewash :hyper:

    You would have said that if England had won 5-0!
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    You were right in what you said anyway. Vaughn is able to captain without his ego or his emotions getting in the way. Freddie aint...
    I'll think you'll find Vaughan's batting was massively affected when he took over as captain and it took a while for that to be sorted out.
    I think now that yes the captaincy did affect Flintoffs performances, hopefully with vaughan back now he'll get the best out of him and we'll win the one-dayers, although we're shitter at them than test matches so it'll be hard work.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I'll think you'll find Vaughan's batting was massively affected when he took over as captain and it took a while for that to be sorted out.
    I think now that yes the captaincy did affect Flintoffs performances, hopefully with vaughan back now he'll get the best out of him and we'll win the one-dayers, although we're shitter at them than test matches so it'll be hard work.

    Yes, his batting was affected, but damn, we need his captaincy. And yeah, I finally agree with you on Flintoff. Hopefully we will now start to see the best of him again now the burden is lifted. Good god, do we need him to get back to his peak...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Yes, his batting was affected, but damn, we need his captaincy. And yeah, I finally agree with you on Flintoff. Hopefully we will now start to see the best of him again now the burden is lifted. Good god, do we need him to get back to his peak...
    TBH, I don't think you can really judge Flintoffs captaining skills from this one series, he was put in a position to captain the side against the best team in the world, players didn't perform including himself and with that happening there was no way of winning tests against the Aussies and kind of forced him to go on the defensive a lot of the time, he had no choice in my opinion.
    Our opening partnership never started with a big total in any innings, maybe 1 innings they got more than 50 before someone was out but thats all. Flintoff, Bell and Collingwood didn't do the business with the bat. Harmison only came into it in the last 2 tests, Giles was poor for the first 3 and Monty did put a bit of life back into the spin department but it wasn't enough, Hoggard had his good days but didn't do enough.
    So for me Flintoffs captaincy was bound to be questioned after the whitewash but I believe it was too many poor performances by too many players which lost us the five tests.
    But we need Flintoff to perform, its a must and if the extra burden of him captaining means he won't then he can't be the captain, his performances with bat and ball are key to any success England are going to have.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    But we need Flintoff to perform, its a must and if the extra burden of him captaining means he won't then he can't be the captain, his performances with bat and ball are key to any success England are going to have.

    And that's the line that sums it up. Flintoff doesn't need to be captain to drive and inspire the team. He needs to do what he does best, and that's bat and bowl, and others will follow. That is freddie's role. As for the rest of your post, I never said that the performance of the whole team was Flintoff's fault. Everybody cocked up at some point and most on more than one occasion - that much is certain. My point was that while Flintoff had the captaincy and as a result was struggling to perform at his best, this went some way to hurting the team. Like I said at the start of this post, Flintoff inspires the rest, and while he was captain and not at his best, I felt he couldn't do this. He is the catalyst - if he performs, England perform. So there is no doubt that Flintoff's situation was a factor in hurting the team's chances this series - how much of a factor, I don't know...
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