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in a democratic country are the civilians are legitimate target
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
just had a thought about this, surely in a democratic country these people consented to their government and/or willing to live under that government, does that make the citizens a legitimate target?
not sure myself, i'd see them as a relatvely pointless target anyway since i'd rather stop their armed forces and leaders 1st
not sure myself, i'd see them as a relatvely pointless target anyway since i'd rather stop their armed forces and leaders 1st
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Democracy doesn't exist.
I disagree.
They would have no compunction about blowing the tube up if we were a totalitarian dictatorship.
Like all political leaders, they see people as expendable pieces. We're nothing but pawns. Please don't dignify these people by saying they are fighting a war, they aren't, they are after power.
Anyon in this country who goes to the same mosques as these preachers of hate should be arrested and kept under house arrest permanently.
They think they can get what they want in their own country by blowing people up in this country.
The people who pull the trigger probably are fighting what they think is a war, but it isn't a war, and what they think is irrelevant anyway. You will always get people to do what you want if you are a skilled enough orator. That is why the only solution is to imprison anyone who comes into contact with them, anyone who associates with them.
And anyone who agrees with what these preachers of hate say should be sent straight to Gitmo.
and, on the other hand, killing their civilians is not the right way to send them message "don't listen your leaders, west isn't evil! put ur guns away and accept our civilised, progressive and human way of living"
democracy is illusion. the last democracy in the human history existed in ancient athens... everything after that is fake..
Because they believe that the people should rise and overthrow them.
It's fairly simple concept really. If you do not do everything possible to turn your state into an Islamic one, then you are a legitimate target.
You are having a laugh. That's the last thing they are.
Primitive illiterate people don't learn how to fly planes, or leave over £140k in the bank after blowing themselves up on tube trains.
however, my point was that bombing the cities and killing the civilians will not solve the problem of terrorism, but only make a fertile ground for their propaganda. do you realy believe that some child in lebanon whos parents were killed in israeli attacks will grow simpaties for us now? or he will join hamas?
west can't win that war. not in this way. it lasts for half of century almost, and it will for next hunderd yrs, for sure.
and on the other hand, if we are yelling that we are more civilised then them, how comes that we also kill civilians, children, destroying their cities?! what is so noble and in that?! i had missfortune to see the war. belive me, my friend, there is nothing noble in war!
my opinion is that israel would make much better succes if it spent these few hunderds million $ on bulding schools or hospitals in lebanon, but on rockets which they hve lounched on their cities only during last few days...
Your message is lost by your rather racist first line.
Where women and slaves didn't have any say in the Government - are you sure that you'd call it a democracy.
But (and its a pretty big but) they can be targets because of where they work or have the bad luck to live. The aim of war is very seldom the absolute destruction of an enemy, but to force him to do your will. This is partially by the defeat of his armies on the battlefield, but also partially destroying his means to support them.
Government buildings, airports, radio stations etc are all legitimate targets and whilst the workers are not targets in themselves they do become targets by virtue of being in a place of military value. However the civilian losses cannot be excessive compared to the military advantage.
Terror attacks designed solely to spread terror and categorically outlawed by the Geneva Conventions.
where do you find racism it that states? i. personaly find more racism in states of those people who approves killing of inocent people. i met some gantleman on some forums who even make jokes about that... well... i'm a bit confused... :eek2:
demos+kratei... they even invented that term.
that is real democracy for there was no any decision of the state that was brought up withot woting of every man that had right to do so.
you are right about slaves and women, but eventhought every family had at least one person who could directly decide about every single question in politics. and we must keep in mind that was about 2500 yrs ago! :chin: i wonder would us, and especialy uk, italy and spain participe in iraq war if those countries had such model of democracy...
But going back to the original question... no. Civilians can never be a legitimate target... whether they are commuters on a bus being killed by a suicide bomber or pedestrians blown to pieces by Hellfire missile fired by the military.
What if they are stupid enough to vote and be part of the so-called "choosing your government" process ?
However saying that if the enemy bombs your civilians then that, in my opinion, opens the door to bombing their civilians. Though it would still be unethical.
now hamas can tell "look what israeli have done to our children! let's kill them all!" i still don't believe it is good strategy...
as in all countries with such regimes (3rd reich, for example) propaganda was of crucial importance. lok at the germans, for example. european nation with great culture, etc, etc... philosophers... all that... and we all know what one corpolar managed to make of them...
i believe it's the same thing here! people are not much smarter then sheeps, and one skillful orator can leed them whenever he wants... even to their doom!
on the other hand, neither do we are able hear what they yell! only pictures we can see are death, fire, blod, and some angry man with long beards shooting they ak's in the air...
i'd really like to have someone from lebanon or palestina to hear what (s)he has to tell about all that mess...