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Sorry for derailment.
I am pro-choice and morally if a woman can choose to abort a 'healthy' fetus at that term then surely she has the choice to abort one with a 'defect'. I would argue however that the weeks at which this is available should be reduced unless there is serious risk of death to mother or child.
I think we should call it a day right here and return to the subject in hand so no further derailing occurs.
With regard to the subject in hand, it might be reprehensible to abort for minor defects, if that is indeed what happens. But at the end of the day it should be the woman's decision to abort, for any reason she might have. So long as this is done within the legal timeframe I don't see much of a problem.
I have a nine year old brother. When my Mum was pregnant with him, a cyst was detected on his forehead in a scan. They said it was likely he was going to be born with downs syndrome but they couldn't be 100% sure. My Mum was offered a late abortion. Of course, she said no. My Mum didn't care. Turns out, when he was born, the cyst was nothing (although he still has it on his forehead. it just isn't anything) and he was a healthy little boy. My Mum was willing to bring up my little brother even if he was downs syndome.
As for the cleft lip thing mentioned in the article, I know someone who has one. He is a lovely guy and has lived his life like any other person although of course, he's had operations and stuff. It annoys me that some women would consider aborting their babies over this when a baby suffering from a cleft lip could live a normal healthy life.
Also, in one of my old jobs, I worked with two people with downs syndome and they were lovely people. They had jobs, they had friends, they had a life. Why should that have been taken away from them?
I don't believe in abortion. I believe abortion should only be used in extreme circumstances, ie, if your life is at risk. At the end of the day, you should be willing to bring up any child you have conceived. As for those mothers who have accidently got pregnant, well, I believe that if you are silly enough to get pregnant, then you should be prepared to deal with the consequences.
Just about everyone seems to agree that abortion laws are outdated - technology now is not the same as in 1967, by any means. Neither are the numbers having abortions. Frankly, that's a good thing - nobody wants a return to deadly back-street alley abortions. The problem is finding any kind of consensus at all. As we're seeing on this thread, there's virtually none there.
which is a big :no: for me
designer babies are already allowed, a couple purposely had a kid that was a tissue match for his brother - im not even sure they wanted another kid, just some tissue for his brother
That's very compassionate, especially coming from an aspiring family lawyer.
God help us.
Here we are talking about women who want perfect babies.
I can judge as I have been in this situation before if you must know. I was pregnant when I was 18 years old. I didn't intend to get pregnant. I was on the pill. Somehow, it failed. I miscarried. Still, till this day, I think about that baby I lost and about how things could have been. I would never ever have had a abortion despite the fact, it wasn't my fault I got pregnant and despite the fact it wasn't right for me at the time. I would have made things work out somehow. I just could never ever have got rid of something so special. I know a few teenage Mums that got pregnant that have done a wonderful job.
As for girls being raped, I don't quite know how I feel on that matter as I've never been in that situation. However, after losing a baby of my own, I don't think I would ever have it in me to abort my own child, no matter who the father was and how that child was conceived.
I'm just giving my personal opinion on the matter love, I'm not making any digs at anyone in particular.
As for claiming there are women who see abortion as merely another means of contraception, I have no idea how widespread a view this is, but whatever the answer, it's a damning indictment of the society we live in. My mother had a miscarriage back in 1986. 20 years on, she still wonders what could have been. I suppose the memories of carrying a child will always be with a woman, no matter what happens during the pregnancy.
I'm sorry to hear about your miscarriage Stacey.
You raise some important issues, abortion is such an emotive subject and I believe that is why a concensus cannot be reached here or in government. I also think that the vast majority of women who choose termination do not do it lightly and I am sure they will think about their potential child for the rest of their lives.
IMO the time limit should be reduced in line with medical progression. I believe all women have the right to decide if they wish to terminate whether their fetus is healthy or not, however not in the current time allowance it should be much lower.
Perhaps the question here is at what stage a fetus becomes a baby and when that baby becomes entitled to rights. Because where do we draw the line, do the people who disagree with abortion disagree with the MAP too?
But abortion is birth control in that it controls the number of births. Before you continue to use such sweeping statements, consider that from the age of 12 or earlier, to the menopause, if a woman has sex, she may become pregnant. Now, *you* happen to believe that if she has sex and becomes pregnant, she has a duty to carry that pregnancy to term. I don't, because I don't believe pregnancy should be treated as a punishment. Also, not everyone is suitable to take hormonal contraception.
Are you reading something I'm not? Have you actually spoken to these women on an individual basis?
I'm sincerely sorry to hear that you miscarried and that choice of your intented pregnancy was taken away from you. No woman should have to go through that. But it still doesn't put you in the situation where you can judge women who have aborted for reasons of abnormality - it's not their fault that women miscarry, or that couples who so want a baby have to go through IVF etc. I also know people who were teenage mothers, and they made great mothers because it was *their* choice, and they weren't forced to carry to term.
Whatever you feel about abortion, please bear in mind that until you have been in that situation, you don't know what you'd do. I see plenty of women at the clinic who tell me how passionately pro-life they once were - until they had an unplanned pregnancy to deal with.
I believe that personhoods and the rights and protection of citizenship are bestowed at birth. I don't deny it's human before then, of course it is, but I believe that so long as it's in the woman's body, she has the final say. The current legal limits give a certain degree of protection to the foetus after 24 weeks, but if someone is determined to abort, there's nothing to stop a woman from travelling to other countries where it is legal.
Some I know do, some don't. I've often been told I'm a ruthless woman for 'flushing out' my babies because I have an interuterine coil. Interestingly enough, an article was recently published suggesting that the 'rhythm method' discards of more embryos than the pill/coils etc.
And for things like downs syndrome, she may feel like she couldn't cope with the baby and doesn't want to go through giving birth then having it adopted or whatever. As long as its inside her, it's up to her what happens with her body.
But some pregnancies that have been terminated were planned ones, so the couples in question obviously didn't use contraception. This doesn't make them stupid, but a lot of people would assume that because they didn't use any to begin with, that makes them irresponsible harlots. I very much doubt anyone would go up to a pregnant woman carrying to term, find out it wasn't planned and call her names under the sun by the assumption that she wasn't using contraception, so why should it be different in pregnancies that are terminated.
I think it was Stargalaxy who asked earlier, regarding contraceptive usage, the AGI's stats are as follows:
Why not get angry at those circumstances in the last sentence, rather than the women themselves?
Well, mr, do you eat Eggs? Do you call it a chicken feotus or a chick when you cook it and eat it?
Hmm, I thought 'abortionist' was the term used by pro-'lifers' to describe the OB/GYNS who perform abortions.