If you need urgent support, call 999 or go to your nearest A&E. To contact our Crisis Messenger (open 24/7) text THEMIX to 85258.
Options
Crusade VS Jihad
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
Ok now we have heard the muslim lobby groups going apeshit over Bush using the word Crusade back at the start of this situation. We have heard them condemning the press for using the word crusade..They say its because crusade is a loaded word and conjures up images of the christian crusades against muslims around 1000 years ago.
Now we come to the word Jihad which is thrown around by everyone in the muslim world. Of course they are quick to explain that it doesnt actually mean holy war as the west always thought but rather a struggle.
Does nobody find the double standard sickening? I certainly do. The word crusade may well have started off to mean holy war against muslims but im sure when colgate launched their 'crusade against tooth decay' they werent thinking of muslim slaughter. Ask someone in the UK what Jihad means and they will say holy war..doesnt matter if their definition is right or wrong, when most people think it to mean holy war then it becomes a loaded word. The word crusade means EXACTLY the same as Jihad and yet one is completely unacceptable and the other is bandied around willy nilly.
"Let's roll......" Todd Beamer, American Hero
Now we come to the word Jihad which is thrown around by everyone in the muslim world. Of course they are quick to explain that it doesnt actually mean holy war as the west always thought but rather a struggle.
Does nobody find the double standard sickening? I certainly do. The word crusade may well have started off to mean holy war against muslims but im sure when colgate launched their 'crusade against tooth decay' they werent thinking of muslim slaughter. Ask someone in the UK what Jihad means and they will say holy war..doesnt matter if their definition is right or wrong, when most people think it to mean holy war then it becomes a loaded word. The word crusade means EXACTLY the same as Jihad and yet one is completely unacceptable and the other is bandied around willy nilly.
"Let's roll......" Todd Beamer, American Hero
0
Comments
and yes, i think the double standard is stupid. the muslims want to wage a holy war - but god forbid if we hurt one of them. this whole world if fucking crazy right and it's pissing me off.
If there's anything more important than my ego around here, i want it caught and shot now
crusade - a remedial enterprise undertaken with zeal and enthusiasm
both pretty ambiguous, huh? but the two religions interpret the other's idea in a very closed-minded way, literally as a religious war. bin laden wants that, and there's probably quite a few christian nuts who want the same. thing is, bush has obligations to use his language responsibly, otherwise he will end up in deep shit. which is why he was condemned for saying it was a 'crusade'. bin laden has no such compulsions - he will use the word 'jihad' in its most visceral sense. and thus it percolates down to some more suggestible muslims.
the double standard thing comes because the more responsible figures on either side want to avoid a return to a crusade mentality. thing is, in the west, those responsible figures are seen as the leaders of their religion and people - the pope, bush, etc. in islam, the situation is different, and there is less clarity of leadership, so bin laden's extremist views are the ones that hit the headlines, whether the muslim world actually wants a jihad or not.
"we have intercourse in every direction" - Karl Marx, The Communist Manifesto (honest!!)
That might be true but its not just the extremists who use the word jihad. There have been dozens of islamic experts, community leaders, groups, MPs etc who agree with the word and say how acceptable it is. When we hear the thousands of people in Pakistan screaming Jihad, the muslims in Britain say...Oh its harmless, they only mean a struggle.
the western world is totally fucked. I pray we never have to fight another real war again. We would lose
Why are we?
You forget that in a war like this, it would be USA,South America, Canada, Western Europe, Russia and it's dependencies, China, Japan, Israel and Australia to name but a few. If it did escalate it would turn into a war against christianity and every other religion that isn't Islam.
Your'e also forgetting that all the aformentioned nations (except Israel) have the capability to use nuclear weapons, and shoot down incoming nuclear weapons. They have the capability of doing far more damage than a terrorist's bio weapon.
Do you have proof of this? Please supply sources, cross referencing with the person's condemnation of the use of the word crusade.
Al,
Firstly, im not your research assistant. If you have missed the entire debate around the word crusade being used or the discussion(even on this very forum) of the word Jihad then you must live in a cave. Look for yourself.
Secondly, I didnt say it was the same people who condemned the word crusade and justified the word jihad so cross referencing would be impossible.
"Let's roll......" Todd Beamer, American Hero
I didn't know Son of Star Wars was already operational and so widespread. <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/smile.gif">
Im not talking militarily. We could easily destroy any alliance put against the western allies if we wanted to
The western world no longer has the stomach or the balls to carry out an extended war, even if its fully justified. Our governments are too afraid of upsetting people, both domestic PC types and foreign types.
If there were a modern day Hitler then I have no doubt he would destroy us completely. We wouldnt dare do anything for fear of offending people.
As for nuclear weapons? Theres no way on gods green earth that ANY western nation would EVER use a nuclear weapon under ANY circumstances. In a nation that is getting in such a strop about around 20 dead civilians do you honestly think we would ever sanction nukes?
PS, Israel has nukes.
they're just not telling anyone, i know.
and yeah, we in the west are pussies, we hate the idea of killing people. and whilst i personally wouldn't object to the use of a nuclear weapon on bin ladens caves or the like, i dont think that something like that is EVER gonna happen. but hey, we can always dream.
what about building a special virus that only affects bin laden, and every other person in the world can act as a host? <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/biggrin.gif"> what a wkd idea!
If there's anything more important than my ego around here, i want it caught and shot now
I think we're going around in circles now.
Thread closed - <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/cool.gif">