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Mladic soon to be caught...

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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    NQA wrote:
    Yugoslavia wasn't an ally of the USSR - despite them both being communist. It wasn't a member of the Warsaw Pact and had always made clear it would fight them if they were invaded (and do the same towards NATO) on the other side.

    However, the Serbs weren't the innocents you make out. All three sides committed atrocities and took part in ethnic cleansing (a rather polite term for murder and rape), but the Serbs were by far the worst.
    If you do some research for once, you will find they were no worse then the Muslim faction within Bosnia itself and not as bad as the Croat Paramilitary forces at all. That is the facts of the period.

    The Warsaw pact has nothing to do with this. You do realise Stalin was long dead and by the time the USSR had Gorbachev in power Yugoslavia and primarily the Serbs, as they are all Slavic peoples were very friendly and openly traded and aided one another when possible. They were not allies in the Warsaw pact, that has nothing to do with this, but the fact is the only reason Russia didnt aid the Serbs, even though there had been promises at the highest levels to do so was because the USSR had only just collapsed and Russia was in no state to help the Serbs, leaving them to be singled out as he only enemy by the entire world.

    The initial proposition of the Serb government when attempting to negotiate in the beginning when the JNA was still multi-cultural was to allow new boarders for the various peoples of Bosnia to be drawn up which was dismissed out of hand and followed up by Croatia arming itself.

    Serbia had all the guns, but not the troops to use them, America bombed from 50,000 feet and dropped in weapons to arm the Muslim faction who were committing genocide against each other as much as the Croats who they supposedly allied with and the Serbs who they were trying to exterminate from within Bosnia.

    I suggest you read "The Balkan War 1991-2002" by R. Craig Nation

    You can download it from here;
    http://www.strategicstudiesinstitute.army.mil/pubs/display.cfm?pubID=123

    It is a highly accurate and also unbiased account. It does not demonise one side and ignore the actions of another. It states the facts of what happened and who did what from all sides. Including accuate accounts of the Genocide and ethnic cleansing activities of the Serbs and Croats.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    My research was 6 months as a platoon commander in Bosnia and another 6 months as a staff officer there; so I'd be grateful if you didn't patronise me. Bearing in mind I've seen the end result of the atrocities, so perhaps I'm not so sure as you about the Serbs being unfairly victimised.

    whatever the rights and wrongs of the war (and it wasn't just the fault of the Serbs) they were much more barbaric than the Croats and the Moslems. all three sides committed mass murder, but the Serbs were in a league of their own.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Since you were stationed there and saw the Serbs actions you must have been posted in a Serb dominated area? I am not trying to patronise you, but if you were posted in an area where you were likely to see results of Serb paramilitaries rather then Croat or Muslim paramilitaries then that would affect your opinion, as it did mine when i visited the country both prior to the conflict when i was young and after when i was older.

    The statistics do not lie however, and it is clear to see the Serb population of Bosnia, mostly civilians were brutalised and suffered higher loses then any other side.

    The politics of the matter making the decisions is the key to understanding the situation. Serbia was eventually backed into a corner and with large armaments but no troops, shipped weapons into the Serb paramilitaries, this of course was illegal, but the Governement saw it as the only way to protect Serb people sin Bosnia.

    The croats didnt arm their paramilitaries because most of them were already armed after having taken control of JNA weapons Depots located nearer Croatia then Serbia.

    The Muslims were armed by America illegally.

    The media made the Serbs out to be all evil and totally to blame. i am not denying they committed horrific atrocities, well the paramilitaries did. But their civilians were as victimised and effected as badly as any of the other Bosnian populations.

    The war was not only preventable but could have even been stopped in its early stages had America not feared the idea of a communist state and forced the Serbs, who were at that time the dominant military and political nation of Croatia. Croatia rushed Secession where as if they had taken time and done it gradually would have almost certainly been granted it. Croatia tried to bully the Bosnian government into siding with them, tearing the country in to two.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Don't get me wrong - the Croats and Moslems were murdering bastards as well. But the Serbs have more blood on their hands by far.

    I don't know if stats lie, but as there has been no agreement on how many died in Bosnia I'm not sure they're telling the truth either.

    http://www.radstats.org.uk/no069/article3.htm

    Serb bombardment and the siege of sarajevo probably cost 10,000 lives. The massacre at Srebenica is 6-8,000. And there was dozens of mini-Sarajevos and Srebenicas the world knows nothing about (and cares even less)

    I do know that I've stood while bodies of Moslem men were pulled out of a pit, with their hands tied behind their backs. And it wasn't the US, the UN or the EU who put them there. that responsibility lies with the men who pulled the triggers and those that gave them the orders.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Indeed, i agree with that.

    The attack of Srebenica was a horrific incident in the war, which not only included the murder and rapes of several thousand but also the deaths of several Dutch peacekeepers who were unarmed and un-aided by their UN and EU superiors.

    The seige of Sarejevo was a tactical mess from all sides. With the Serbs shelling from outside the city and Muslim and Croats forces/snipers killing each other from within.

    The Serb troops such as Mladic's forces and Arkans Tigers were brutally evil, undeniable. But the escalation of the conflict can not be passed to one side.


    You know the JNA could have stopped the war before it began by intervening to prevent completely any of the member states Seceding from the Yugoslav Union. How hindsight is so clear, eh?
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