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  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Vox populi, vox Dei:
    <STRONG>
    So you'd rather be in an up-close fight with someone carrying a gun, rather than someone carrying a knife?</STRONG>

    Yes I would. Without training then im gonna get stabbed or shot anyway and id much rather be shot than stabbed.

    Anyone who thinks they can defend themselves against a determined man with a knife is kidding themselves. Attempt to deflect them? When 6"+ of sharpened steel comes into contact with an arm made of flesh and bone, it doesnt deflect.

    [ 30-04-2002: Message edited by: Balddog ]
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by DevilMan:
    <STRONG>And at least with a gun, you have the option of splattering brains all over the wall behind your attacker, thus ENDING the threat.

    Thanks but no thanks, I'd rather keep my guns - I can fight off assholes with knives, guns and whatever else they decide to try and kill me with.</STRONG>


    Er...have you actually <STRONG>read</STRONG> the rest of the thread?

    1. It wasn't about <STRONG>you</STRONG> being armed. It was about your opponent - would you be more concerned about a gun or a knife.

    2. You kinda make the anti-gun lobby's point for them. Their assertion is that facing a knife is preferable, by saying that you would prefer to <STRONG>use</STRONG> a gun (because it is more effective) you have just further validated that assertion. Thank you.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Man Of Kent:
    <STRONG>2. You kinda make the anti-gun lobby's point for them. Their assertion is that facing a knife is preferable, by saying that you would prefer to [qb]use</STRONG> a gun (because it is more effective) you have just further validated that assertion. Thank you.[/QB]
    Funny how Thanatos has shut the hell up pretty damned quickly in this one...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Man Of Kent:
    <STRONG>


    Er...have you actually [qb]read</STRONG> the rest of the thread?

    1. It wasn't about <STRONG>you</STRONG> being armed. It was about your opponent - would you be more concerned about a gun or a knife.

    2. You kinda make the anti-gun lobby's point for them. Their assertion is that facing a knife is preferable, by saying that you would prefer to <STRONG>use</STRONG> a gun (because it is more effective) you have just further validated that assertion. Thank you.[/QB]

    Naah Hardly - look at it this way - Id prefer not to be in the situation at all - all Im saying is this yes, Id rather be shot than stabbed, CDC data and all relevant data suggest the stab wound is liklier to kill me.

    Secondly, I only made the 'effectiveness' point in this way - if someone has intents to kill me be it with a knife, gun or whatever, yes the gun is a far preferable, more effective means of self defense.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Kentish:
    <STRONG>
    Funny how Thanatos has shut the hell up pretty damned quickly in this one...</STRONG>

    Funny how having ATT go through one of their frequent FUBAR moments dis-enables one from reading, much less posting.

    Situation rectumfied.

    I am certain that you await my full return {awol from work momentarily} with bated breath... <IMG SRC="wink.gif" border="0" ALT="icon">
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    not to sound like a total ignoramus, but I have no idea what an ATT or a frequent FUBAR moment is. Would someone widen my knowledge of the universe?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Prufrock:
    <STRONG>not to sound like a total ignoramus, but I have no idea what an ATT or a frequent FUBAR moment is. Would someone widen my knowledge of the universe?</STRONG>
    AT&T is presumably his phone company, and apparently FUBAR = F***ed Up Beyond All Recognition .
    But I didn't know that either.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I figured this was more relevant here than in the Murdered Dutchman thread, and I didn't want that to be hijacked by the guns argument...

    But did you notice how he was shot six times by a fully loaded <STRONG>knife</STRONG>?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    He would have been dead a lot sooner had he been stabbed 6 times in the head and neck. <IMG SRC="wink.gif" border="0" ALT="icon">
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Balddog:
    <STRONG>He would have been dead a lot sooner had he been stabbed 6 times in the head and neck. <IMG SRC="wink.gif" border="0" ALT="icon"></STRONG>
    This is all academic, but would the murderer have been able to stab him 6 times before his aides intervened?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Kentish:
    <STRONG>
    This is all academic, but would the murderer have been able to stab him 6 times before his aides intervened?</STRONG>


    Yes...go get a kitchin knife and see how fast you can stab.

    As you said, its academic..Its more than likely that fewer than 6 stab wounds to the head would have been needed to kill him....6 bullets only served to wound him and he died a while later.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Balddog:
    <STRONG>Yes...go get a kitchin knife and see how fast you can stab.

    As you said, its academic..Its more than likely that fewer than 6 stab wounds to the head would have been needed to kill him....6 bullets only served to wound him and he died a while later.</STRONG>
    Granted, you can stab someone repeatedly, but at least you can run away from a knife <IMG SRC="wink.gif" border="0" ALT="icon">

    He died at the scene.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Not when hes that close...The guy was shot from close range..He died at the scene but some time after he was shot. Wasnt like in the films where they fall down dead immediately.


    PS, im slightly worried that i just went downstairs and repeated stabbed a melon with a kitchin knife.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Balddog:
    <STRONG>PS, im slightly worried that i just went downstairs and repeated stabbed a melon with a kitchin knife.</STRONG>
    roflol <IMG SRC="biggrin.gif" border="0" ALT="icon">

    Fruit salad anyone?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I think you've missed the point.

    It doesn't matter how many times he was shot, how long it took him to die, or how many slices your melon is in Baldy <IMG SRC="biggrin.gif" border="0" ALT="icon">

    It makes no difference if one stab wound would have been enough, if his aides would have stopped a knife, or if he could have run away.

    The point is that the assassin's weapon of choice was a <STRONG>gun</STRONG> and not a knife.

    As usual.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Cowards use guns <IMG SRC="wink.gif" border="0" ALT="icon">
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    What was the line in Lockstock..Guns for show, knives for a pro..

    His aides(assuming he had any) were fuckin useless anyway because they just let the bloke walk off after blowing their bosses head off.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Balddog:
    <STRONG>His aides(assuming he had any) were fuckin useless anyway because they just let the bloke walk off after blowing their bosses head off.</STRONG>
    Don't know where you're getting your info Baldy, but 4 of them chased after the guy, and were shot at.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Theyre sposed to be bodyguards...Did you not see the clint eastwood film? They shoulda thrown themselves through the air in slow motion and caught the bullets in the bible tucked in their shirt.

    They let him get away.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Balddog:
    <STRONG>Theyre sposed to be bodyguards...Did you not see the clint eastwood film? They shoulda thrown themselves through the air in slow motion and caught the bullets in the bible tucked in their shirt.

    They let him get away.</STRONG>

    Or better still caught the bullets in their hands, like in that film with Christopher Reeve <IMG SRC="biggrin.gif" border="0" ALT="icon">

    They let him get away, becuase he was shooting at them.

    With his knife.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Man Of Kent:
    <STRONG>

    Or better still caught the bullets in their hands, like in that film with Christopher Reeve <IMG SRC="biggrin.gif" border="0" ALT="icon">

    They let him get away, becuase he was shooting at them.

    With his knife.</STRONG>

    AH..just for the record, it was 4 members of the public who chased the gunman...He didnt have any aides...He had recently hired private security but couldnt afford to have constant protection.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I've seen a film too. It was called Grumpy Old Men - and thats what you two are behaving like <IMG SRC="rolleyes.gif" border="0" ALT="icon">

    He didn't have any bodyguards - he was with his aide, and driver.

    They did chase after the gunman, but were then shot at.

    He died within half an hour - I don't think he'd have died sooner with stab wounds.

    The murderer used a gun because you can shoot and run with a gun - they require no close-range attack.

    If the Dutch guy had been armed, he would still be dead.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ive lost all comprehension of what this thread is about so im just talking out of my arse <IMG SRC="tongue.gif" border="0" ALT="icon">

    He would have died sooner with 6 stab wounds to his head..Thats almost certain.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Balddog:
    <STRONG>He would have died sooner with 6 stab wounds to his head..Thats almost certain.</STRONG>
    You're guessing. And so would I be if I were to dispute it.

    Either way he's dead.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Balddog:
    <STRONG>im just talking out of my arse <IMG SRC="tongue.gif" border="0" ALT="icon"></STRONG>

    Its always nice to see that no matter what else is going on in the world, some things never change <IMG SRC="biggrin.gif" border="0" ALT="icon">

    <STRONG>
    He would have died sooner with 6 stab wounds to his head..Thats almost certain.</STRONG>

    But he wasn't stabbed. He was shot.

    It makes no difference what <STRONG>could</STRONG> have happened. What is relevant is what <STRONG>did</STRONG> happen.

    What actually happened was that, as usual, a gun was the assassin's weapon of choice.

    He could have used a knife but didn't. He, like most other assassins and like most (single incident) mass murderers, chose to use a gun.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Well I was going to come back with an incredibly witty, incredibly intelligent counter remark but instead i will leave you with this..


    Man of Kent smells of wee wee. <IMG SRC="tongue.gif" border="0" ALT="icon">
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Kentish:
    <STRONG>Cowards use guns <IMG SRC="wink.gif" border="0" ALT="icon"></STRONG>

    Hmm well seeing as how there were 2.5 million defensive uses of firearms in the US last year, we have a lot of cowards don't we?

    But at least they survived. <IMG SRC="biggrin.gif" border="0" ALT="icon">

    <IMG SRC="biggrin.gif" border="0" ALT="icon">
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Kentish:
    <STRONG>Cowards use guns <IMG SRC="wink.gif" border="0" ALT="icon"></STRONG>

    ... and fools do not. They come to the confrontation armed with their "high ideals", and then are dispatched to their graves.

    Darwin at work.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Owning a gun doesn't make you immortal.

    I know that may be a surprise to you, but you <STRONG>will</STRONG> still die, and as far as I'm aware <STRONG>not</STRONG> owning a gun isn't terminal.

    This is where the difference between our cultures comes to the fore. We see you as being paranoid, that you see everyone that approaches you as a potential threat. That paranoia means that you feel the need to be armed at all times, just in case.

    Personally, I don't feel so threatened.

    But the foundations of my country (and I don't mean the revolution) weren't laid at the hands of the gunslinger only 200 years ago. We don't have the recent 'kill or be killed' history that you have.
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