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the wonders of thatcher

Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_depth/4447082.stm


nice plain diagrams

look at disposable income, then look at the poorest 10% compared to the richest 10%

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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    the rich ah getting richer every day
    and the little that the poor man has will be given away
    hear what I say...hear what I say...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Shame there isn't a graphic for children living under the poverty line... That'd be very telling indeed.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I always appreciated the way Maggie Thatcher re-built Britain after the "winter of discontent" and all that and how she tackled the unions, but dismantling British industry and in essence ruining the future economy of the nation was a terrible mistake in Governance! Rich get richer, Poor get poorer, That was the 80's for you.

    Who else watched the New Statesman?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    subject13 wrote:
    I always appreciated the way Maggie Thatcher re-built Britain after the "winter of discontent" and all that and how she tackled the unions, but dismantling British industry and in essence ruining the future economy of the nation was a terrible mistake in Governance! Rich get richer, Poor get poorer, That was the 80's for you.

    Who else watched the New Statesman?

    You appreciate her rebuilding Britain but dismantling industry was a mistake, doesn't one cancel out the other?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I understand the sentiment; the unions were ruling the country, and did need to be taught a lesson. But, as always, it then went too far the other way.

    The unions were the tail wagging the dog, to be fair.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Exactly right Kermit!

    So no one else liked Rik Mayall as Alan B'Stard then? Oh well...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    The B'Stard character was funny, but Yes, Minister was better by miles...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    the best thing mrs t did ...was allow pubs to open all day.
    they used to have to close at 3pm you know ...and not open again till 5.30 pm.
    the usual scare mongers were screamimg the usual nonsense ...the streets will be full of drunks ...it will ruin industry blah blah blah ...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Why does all of that sound familiar? :chin:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    Why does all of that sound familiar? :chin:
    i think stargalaxy should answer that one.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Yes, Minister and Yes, Prime Minister! Awesome television!
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    Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Posts: 13,332 Born on Earth, Raised by The Mix
    BlackArab wrote:
    You appreciate her rebuilding Britain but dismantling industry was a mistake, doesn't one cancel out the other?

    Well, the fact we have no industry in my eyes counts and deconstructing Britain, we produce shit-all now, everything is amde abroad.

    If we were blockaded in a majour war, we'd be fucked.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    subject13 wrote:
    Exactly right Kermit!

    So no one else liked Rik Mayall as Alan B'Stard then? Oh well...

    So reduce the industrial base and reduce the unions, the only problem was we end up spending North Sea oil money on dole payments for nearly 4 million unemployed as a result.

    ps much preferred 'The Young Ones' if we're talking Rik Mayall
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    At the time, in the context of who had the power and how to deal with it we had a choice of a 3 day week or high unemployment. Niether option was good but it was at the time in that context all we had.

    Bottom was a good show too.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    J wrote:
    Anyway, if a woman reports a rape it isn't just going to go unpunished is it? Mind you, I reported my abuse (well, they found the pics of me and others then contacted me) and they did nothing, the case was dropped!!! Abuse fucks people up (if only slightly) it shouldn't have gone un-punished. I forgive the bloke if he's got a good reason to be like that (maybe he was abused) but still...
    Is thi sin the right thread J?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Teh_Gerbil wrote:
    Well, the fact we have no industry in my eyes counts and deconstructing Britain, we produce shit-all now, everything is amde abroad.

    If we were blockaded in a majour war, we'd be fucked.

    Did Thatcher destroy the industry herself, or would it have gone anyway? Did Thatcher make Rover close down, or did that happen for other reasons?

    Yes in case of war with a major nation then having some self-sufficincy is useful, otherwise it is pointless, are or are we not more wealthy now than we were in the 70s, when we had far more industry?

    China has far more industry than the UK yet we are far richer....
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Toadborg wrote:
    Did Thatcher destroy the industry herself, or would it have gone anyway? Did Thatcher make Rover close down, or did that happen for other reasons?

    Yes in case of war with a major nation then having some self-sufficincy is useful, otherwise it is pointless, are or are we not more wealthy now than we were in the 70s, when we had far more industry?

    China has far more industry than the UK yet we are far richer....
    thatcher basicly shut down mining shipbuilding textiles and heavy engineering ...all huge at the time.

    whats that old saying about a nation that doesn't produce its own bread ...being at the mercy of?

    we are now almost totaly reliant on gas imports ...from some not so stable countries.
    ever heard of economic warfare?
    if we don't agree to something or other ...they switch the taps off ...we're fucked.
    oil imports ...plus most of our food suplies are now imported.
    precarious situation ?
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    Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Posts: 13,332 Born on Earth, Raised by The Mix
    As above - what would we do if China said "Fuck you mate, nothing is going to you anymore!!" ? We'd be right up shit creak. Without a boat or paddle.

    We should not be dependant.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Teh_Gerbil wrote:
    As above - what would we do if China said "Fuck you mate, nothing is going to you anymore!!" ? We'd be right up shit creak. Without a boat or paddle.

    We should not be dependant.

    Lovely theory - but if we decided not to trade and make verrything ourselves (going against eight hundred years of tradition) we'd swiftly become one of the poorest nations in the world - at which point it wouldn't really matter what China was planning to do to us (unless it was to stop the food aid to feed our starving population)
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    Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Posts: 13,332 Born on Earth, Raised by The Mix
    NQA wrote:
    Lovely theory - but if we decided not to trade and make verrything ourselves (going against eight hundred years of tradition) we'd swiftly become one of the poorest nations in the world - at which point it wouldn't really matter what China was planning to do to us (unless it was to stop the food aid to feed our starving population)

    I didn't say that. I just think we should at least make some things, you know - basics. Making EVERYTHING is stupid, we should make what we can, instead of being so focussed on cutting costs.

    Britain has made some of the best Ships ever - we still could. Why don't we? Cheaper to get crap foreign ones. Cost should not be the only driving factor.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    NQA wrote:
    Lovely theory - but if we decided not to trade and make verrything ourselves (going against eight hundred years of tradition) we'd swiftly become one of the poorest nations in the world - at which point it wouldn't really matter what China was planning to do to us (unless it was to stop the food aid to feed our starving population)
    who said anything about stopping trading?
    why do you think the rebuilding of nuclear power plants is realy back on the agenda?
    cos in twenty years we will be reliant on other nations for almost all our energy needs thats why.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Teh_Gerbil wrote:
    Britain has made some of the best Ships ever - we still could. Why don't we? Cheaper to get crap foreign ones. Cost should not be the only driving factor.
    Fortunately we still make (and export!) ships, particularly warships, these being high-tech, expensive beasts, compared with the cargo ships the far east make, which are basically boxes with engines.
    Its the same with cars. We still have the likes of Lotus and Aston Martin in this country producing high tech sports cars. Production of cheap family cars, however, is going more and more to the far east.

    We still have plenty of engineering skill in this country, but labour costs are so high here that often it is far cheaper to build stuff in China or Korea.
    Toadborg wrote:
    Did Thatcher destroy the industry herself, or would it have gone anyway? Did Thatcher make Rover close down, or did that happen for other reasons?

    Whether Thatcher sorted out the unions or not I don't think it would have made any difference. Labour costs would still have risen and these industries would have still gone under. Its a shame, but thats progress for you.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru


    Whether Thatcher sorted out the unions or not I don't think it would have made any difference. Labour costs would still have risen and these industries would have still gone under. Its a shame, but thats progress for you.

    Exactly.

    We shoudl do the things we are good at doing.

    China is now as dependent on the rest of the world as we are on them, trade creates interdependence that makes war more unlikely (as if we would go to war with China anyway)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Oh and UK has always been one of the highest trading nations in the modern world, and it hasn't stopped us going to war in the past.........
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Although of course, what you're all forgetting is that these things don't "just happen" - they are made to happen. Smashing the unions and destroying industry was actually part of a long term political plan, drawing on the ideas of every torie's favourite mass murderer Pinochet.
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