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British or not????

Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
Just from the News last night regarding the terror raids on people suspected of plotting the kidnap and torture of a British born Muslim soldier!!
In a poll on the news ONLY 20% of muslims would be happy if a family member was in the British Forces, something like 30% would accept it and the rest would be totally against it!!
This really gets to me and I'm no racist but why do they want to live in our country and claim our benefits but they are not willing to fight for us??
How can anyone justify the kidnapping of a fellow muslim just because he is fighting for HIS country?? (I know this is only a minority who would justify this).
That poll scares me slightly though, you live in our country you should be willing to fight for our country!!
Discuss or flame me, I'm willing to change my views if someone can convince me I'm in the wrong for thinking like this!!
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Comments

  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Have to got the % rates of how white people would feel about being in/having a family member in the army ? Even so, according to the poll you quote, 50% of muslims would be happy or accepting of a family member in the army. What about the don't knows ?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    well im British, happy to live here and claim benefits if I need them, but they can fuck off if they think ill fight for them or go to war.

    Im not surprised a lot of British muslims wouldnt want to join the British Army, as half the time it seems like theyd be pitched against their parents or grandparents country.
    Best to just not join tbh.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    That's about right. Though I imagine for non-muslims that there would be a less percentage totally against their family joining the army. But my family would be slightly unimpressed if I joined, they wouldn't stop talking to me, but my sister and my brother-in-law in particular would disapprove.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I'd love to fight for my country but sadly I'd miss my home life too much. If it came to it though, I'd be straight there!
    Though not everyone wants to go to war for many different reasons.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Erm.

    I guess you'd have to compare it to the same statisic for non Muslim 'British' families.

    My family are (apart from possibly me) white Christian British through and through. My brother keeps threatening to join the army and I don't think I'd be too happy with it, I'd accept it, but not be happy with it.

    No problem with him fighting for our country, but would have one with him fighting in someone else country for no good reason.

    If the objection is that the familiy members are becoming part of British establishment then I think you're right, if it's because of concern for welfare then I've got no problem with it.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    VinylVicky wrote: »
    If it came to it though, I'd be straight there!

    As long as you can finish your eclair first ? :D
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    i think they should just bring back national service, force everyone to serve the country at some point in there life
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    .
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    well im British, happy to live here and claim benefits if I need them, but they can fuck off if they think ill fight for them or go to war.
    I couldn't handle the army either or the forces but thats me as a person, some people it suits, others it doesn't but thats not the point. If my son or daughter (when i have them, lol) wanted to join then I wouldn't be totally against it, I'd be happy about it if thats what they wanted to do!!
    Its this divide that bugs the hell out of me and the way our govenrment have had there pants down and being royally bummed by people they have let live in our country.
    It seems to me that they are happy being British when it suits them, benefits, NHS etc. but other than that they don't seem to be interested in being British at all.
    This is BRITISH muslims allegedly planning to kidnap and murder another BRITISH muslim??? So how I see it is that they are kidnapping one of their own because he is actually being British, when they should be doing the same if they are living in this country!! Religion totally to one side, at the end of the day they are British and if they don't want to be part of Britain and our culture then they should fuck off, oh but then they won't be able to claim benefit, our government are getting bummed till they bleed.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    You said it yourself. You're talking about a minority.

    Get people like that in every area of life. Like the british people who stole the remains of another british person, because they didn't like the things her british family were doing.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    If the objection is that the familiy members are becoming part of British establishment then I think you're right, if it's because of concern for welfare then I've got no problem with it.
    Thats the point I'm getting at really but not so well put in my post.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    .
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    RubberSkin wrote: »
    As long as you can finish your eclair first ? :D

    haha yes - hopefully burn it off!
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    That's not racism sophia, stop throwing it around, because it's nothing short of fucking irritating. It's completely acceptable to say that someone who has no interest in being a part of your culture should fuck off and be a part of someone else's culture.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote: »
    You said it yourself. You're talking about a minority.

    Get people like that in every area of life. Like the british people who stole the remains of another british person, because they didn't like the things her british family were doing.
    No, watching the news last night and the MAJORITY were saying they don't expect any charges to be made cos its just the police victimising them HA!! Ye thats why the book shop they raided had lots of books about terrorism etc..
    Its only a minority who would take the action of kidnapping and beheading!!
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    .
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Well 100% of people in my house would be vehemently opposed to joining the British Army. But I'm as British as the next lad born in Sydney. It's amazing what you can do with statistics.

    Sophia, its not racist, can you use another word for a change?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    so someones basically done half a survey, and now it seems that british muslims arnt being british enough?!

    bullshit. my family would be well pissed off if i joined the army, which is just as well cos i dont ever plan on doing so.

    i dont think people of this country are any better or more derserving than someone from any other country, so theres no way im going to go and fight battles against some poor sod just like me because our governments have beef with each other.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    .
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Sophia, it may be harsh, it may be brutal, it may be blunt, but it's not racist. It's asking that people who want to be citizens of a country have a level a involvement and respect for the cultures, the laws and the institutions of that country.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    You're going to have to give me some facts lickalotapuss. But until then, lets consider the situation, Muslims are really on the back foot, there's a lot of backlash because at the moment terrorist=muslim and muslim=terrorist/supporter of terrorism. I wouldn't be surprised if the muslim community at large feels got at and as such feels compelled to defend itself. Traditional defence means retreating and digging a trench and filling it with pointy sticks. Most of what your average person says that's outrageous is digging a trench and filling it with pointy sticks.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote: »
    That's not racism sophia, stop throwing it around, because it's nothing short of fucking irritating. It's completely acceptable to say that someone who has no interest in being a part of your culture should fuck off and be a part of someone else's culture.
    Pisses me off aswell, I know am no racist so keep throwing at me if you want cos i'll just ignore it and it won't bother me either!
    I want to be part of a mulit-cultural society BUT not one like this, not one where the Muslims are alledgedly planning such a thing so they can scare the law abiding muslims into not joining the forces, the police etc..
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    sophia wrote: »
    Yeah yeah sure, whatever, it isn't racism. Why are we talking about Muslims, and not white British people who don't want to fight?

    Because the discussion was prompted by an event which involed the objection of some 'British' Muslims at the involvement of other British Muslims with a British institution.

    :banghead:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fiend_85 wrote: »
    muslim community


    i think the whole point really is that there shouldn’t be a Muslim community, they split British into different communities with different views, if we was to just have a British Community then surly there wouldn’t be a problem with people integrating into the country?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    sophia wrote: »
    Yeah yeah sure, whatever, it isn't racism. Why are we talking about Muslims, and not white British people who don't want to fight?
    Because this question stems from a whole pile of issues to do with islamic integration. British culture does not necessarily mean that you have to drink your tea thick enough to float a horseshoe on with milk and two please luv, it does not necessarily mean you'll join up to show jonny foreigner what for, it does not necessarily mean you're up for giving anyone six of the best. All of those things are part of it in some way, but there are hundreds, thousands of other little things that are part of british culture as well. Like queuing, and saying sorry when it's not your fault, and thinking good table manners are next to godliness. All most people would ask is there be some sign of giving back to the culture they're taking all the nice things from, making something new and better that what there was before.

    Territ, why shouldn't there be a muslim community? You can be a part of more than one community, like I'm part of the Ultimate community, it's nice, I know people from all over the country who play ultimate and only get ultimate jokes and do ultimate things, but I'm part of my church community too, and the two are completely separate, but neither stops me from being part of both.

    You can be Muslim and British. Just like I can play sport and be a christian. They are not exclusive terms.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    .
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I think you'll find that he said that he felt that part of being british was a willingness to support a desire to join the armed forces, and that he was up for having his mind changed. So now that you're wrong, are you going to pipe down?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    .
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Just from the News last night regarding the terror raids on people suspected of plotting the kidnap and torture of a British born Muslim soldier!!
    In a poll on the news ONLY 20% of muslims would be happy if a family member was in the British Forces, something like 30% would accept it and the rest would be totally against it!!
    This really gets to me and I'm no racist but why do they want to live in our country
    Probably for the same reasons you want to live in it as well. They are British.
    and claim our benefits
    What, all of them?

    Not sure you want to go down that road. I suspect if there was such a statistic as a breakdown of benefit claimants by race and/or religious background, those evil terrorist Muslims would have fewer people on benefits than most others.

    Not that it matters.
    but they are not willing to fight for us??
    For 'us'?

    Do you think illegally invading other nations and contributing, even if indirectly, to the slaughter of more than half a million innocent men, women and children is fighting "for us"?

    I hope you're under no illusions that people from any other race or religious background would be much more willing to send one of their relatives to fight Blair's dirty genocidal wars. The immense majority of the country is repulsed and disgusted at the actions of our war criminal leader.

    And it does not come as much of a surprise that people of a certain faith that has been persecuted relentlessly by our crusading Christian leaders for decades are even more reluctant to join the Armed Forces and possibly be sent to participate in the aggression than the rest of us are.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Look SOPHIA, think what the fuck you like about me!! I'm not into politics and that and a few people in this thread have described what I was going on about a hell of a lot better than I have.
    Just pisses me off how we can have people in our country are allegedly going to kidnap and murder another british muslim because hes in the armed forces. And basically what I'm saying is "why the fuck are these people in our country if they hate the British so much?? And why don't they just fuck off". They don't fuck off cos we're a good country who give them the nice things in life when there out of work, unable to work through illness/injury and like someone said I believe they should give something back rather than fight against us.
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