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Bombs on planes?

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  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Maybe, but behind a hell of a lot of critiscism of Israel lurks a latent anti-semitism.

    That depends on your definition of anti-semitism.

    By the Zionist definition, any suggestion of opposition to the state of Isreal as a principle constitutes anti-semitism; only criticism of Israel's way of doing business is considered legitimate (i.e, the status quo itself can't be questioned or you're a nasty jew-hater).

    That's quite obviously bullshit. Opposition to the Israel state does not equate to holding a grudge against jews as a people, which is the common-sense definition - and I haven't seen many posts on here which would qualify.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Wait a minute. How did this get from a thread about a plot to hijack planes to a thread about Israel? This isn't the "FAO those who think Israel's actions have been justified & proportioned part 3452" thread! This is what happens when Jim V disappears for a whole week. Come back, Jim - all is forgiven.

    Personally, I don't doubt there was a plot. However, I think it's all been blown out of proportion. This is for several reasons. The first is, it's the middle of summer, and silly season is going strong in the media. Our papers need something to write about/scare us over, and this story (including a "15-page souvenir special" courtesy of the Daily Mail last Friday) fits the bill perfectly. The second is, our authorities desperately want to show they're getting something right after recent cock-ups. Forest Gate, anyone?

    One other question - where is Blair amidst all this? Not Tony Blair - he who suns himself in the Carribean on yet another holiday probably being paid for by Sir Cliff Richard. If he was in the country, the reaction would probably have been even worse than that of the real stand-in Prime Minister of the moment, John Reid. No, I'm talking of Sir Ian Blair. Has he finally learnt to keep his mouth shut? We can but hope!
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Teh_Gerbil wrote:
    No, they were funded and intiated by the Autorities, under orders from the Tsar.

    THAT is why they happened. Could at least get your facts right.

    Which tsar? Pobedonostsev might have ordered the Holy League about but there were no direct orders from Alexander III, indeed he outlawed the Holy League...That said many within his government sympathised.

    Later pogroms under Nicholas II by the Black Hundreds probably did have the support and sympathy of the tsar but there's little evidence to suggest there were direct orders.

    And the Holy League and Black Hundreds were separate organisations from the tsarist bureaucracy making your simple claim that they were 'funded and initated' - it's initiated btw a bit weak.
  • Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Posts: 13,332 Born on Earth, Raised by The Mix
    Which tsar? Pobedonostsev might have ordered the Holy League about but there were no direct orders from Alexander III, indeed he outlawed the Holy League...That said many within his government sympathised.

    Later pogroms under Nicholas II by the Black Hundreds probably did have the support and sympathy of the tsar but there's little evidence to suggest there were direct orders.

    And the Holy League and Black Hundreds were separate organisations from the tsarist bureaucracy making your simple claim that they were 'funded and initated' - it's initiated btw a bit weak.

    Oh, I typoed ;o I must be wrong.

    Of course, they didn't publically fund it. Oh, and I am refering to Nicholas II - he did agree with Pobedonostsev, and was highly anti-semetic. Evidence suggests he probably did order them. Alexander III was the last Tsar with any reasonable qualities too him. Nicholas I was also highly anti-semetic. Throughout the reigns of both Nicholas's (Nicholases?) anti-semetism was well ingrained in thier policies and actions. Nicolas II though, acted more upon it. There were many Police Officers and Military men in the pogroms - whilst they supported the anti-semetism for the most part - they were also ordered to go along with it. After all, it was much a public action as the pro-Castro rallies in Cuba are. Sure, there was no government initiative there at all...:rolleyes:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    And I never disputed or contradicted that...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    As the mod pointed out at the time his latest outburst isn't the first on these boards...There's been various instances, the excuse that he was 'drunk' doesn't excuse repeated anti-Semitic comments and I doubt he was even drunk in every instance...

    Given that you don't think anti-Semitism (or racism?) is a big deal if someone is drunk what do you make of the Mel Gibson story? Or the Russian pogroms? I mean the perpetrators were mainly ordinary Russians riled up with propaganda and vodka by the Holy League. Or is it only a problem if somebody acts upon such views?

    Will you just shut your silly wee face for once. I said I was sorry, it's quite clear what the circumsatances was around my post regarding Jews, I was drunk now please fuck off and stop talking about it.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    As the mod pointed out at the time his latest outburst isn't the first on these boards...There's been various instances, the excuse that he was 'drunk' doesn't excuse repeated anti-Semitic comments and I doubt he was even drunk in every instance...

    Given that you don't think anti-Semitism (or racism?) is a big deal if someone is drunk what do you make of the Mel Gibson story? Or the Russian pogroms? I mean the perpetrators were mainly ordinary Russians riled up with propaganda and vodka by the Holy League. Or is it only a problem if somebody acts upon such views?

    don't be a dick
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kermit wrote:
    You're really quite boring, aren't you?

    OMFGZ he sed sumfin nasty!

    It was completely out of order and wouldn't have been tolerated in the same way if he had said much the same about other "races", I don't see why it should be treated any different.

    Being drunk is no excuse.
  • Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Posts: 13,332 Born on Earth, Raised by The Mix
    It was completely out of order and wouldn't have been tolerated in the same way if he had said much the same about other "races", I don't see why it should be treated any different.

    Being drunk is no excuse.

    Just wondering how you would address something that happened whilst I was with friends.

    A friend of mine (who is coloured) was with us on a pub crawl in Berlin. We were getting the train (all rather sloshed) and he decided it would be amusing to shout "P*ki on a train!" loudly. Rather embrassing but amusing at the time.

    What should be done about this? Is it alright, like black people calling each other n*gger?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Teh_Gerbil wrote:
    he decided it would be amusing to shout "P*ki on a train!" loudly. Rather embrassing but amusing at the time.

    Aimed at someone?
    Is it alright, like black people calling each other n*gger?

    There is such a thing as context.

    In the case of the argument here it was abusive. Had the user posted a comment to the effect that "any group of blacks is violent" there would have been uproar.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    It was completely out of order and wouldn't have been tolerated in the same way if he had said much the same about other "races", I don't see why it should be treated any different.

    Being drunk is no excuse.

    Well I certainly reported it. The reason that I didn't publicly pick turlough up on it was (a) because turlough has a track record of trolling when drunk and (b) I wanted to see if dis would have a go at me if I didn't say anything. Seems I was right.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    (a) because turlough has a track record of trolling when drunk and

    Now it seems he also has a track record of being a rascist scumbag when drunk.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Now it seems he also has a track record of being a rascist scumbag when drunk.

    No, he has a track record of being on the wind up when drunk. What's your excuse anyway? Are you constantly pissed or what?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    No, he has a track record of being on the wind up when drunk

    Odd way to go 'on the wind up' don't you think? Nobody else I know resorts to rascism to do so. Normal behaviour to you is it?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Odd way to go 'on the wind up' don't you think?

    Effective though innit.
    Nobody else I know resorts to rascism to do so. Normal behaviour to you is it?

    No, I don't find it funny. WHICH IS WHY I REPORTED IT TO THE MODS
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Effective though innit.

    Well, yes, any sane person would be grossly offended by such rascism.
    No, I don't find it funny. WHICH IS WHY I REPORTED IT TO THE MODS

    Perhaps, but you then did not condemn Turlough for what he said and proceeded to make excuses for him.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Whatever Mat. I know you don't really care about racism, you just want a row. Well go ahead, row on your own. I don't give a fuck.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote:
    turlough has a track record of trolling when drunk

    His signature, intended to be inflamatory, is still there. Do we presume that he is permanently inebriated?

    Trolling is no excuse either.
    I wanted to see if dis would have a go at me if I didn't say anything. Seems I was right.

    I posted because I was surprised that you hadn't commented. It's not like you to let something like that go without a public comment - as well as reporting it.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    It was a little experiment to see who would get all self righteous on me - surprise surprise it was dis and Mat - people not usually known for giving a shit about racism.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I know what you mean. Not sure that there would have been the same outrage had he said "muslims"...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    - people not usually known for giving a shit about racism.

    How did you come up with this rubbish?
  • Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Posts: 13,332 Born on Earth, Raised by The Mix
    Aimed at someone?

    Himself?
    There is such a thing as context.

    In the case of the argument here it was abusive. Had the user posted a comment to the effect that "any group of blacks is violent" there would have been uproar.

    True. But using of racist terms at all is a grey area. Someone can just say "i was only joking" even though they wern't. And can you provide proof either way?

    Turloug does go on the wind up when drunk. And he sure gets the response he looked for! Ah, some of you expect everyone to immediatley post "OMFG RACISTS?!!?!>!" when he does it. Doesn't a silent "report" do enough?

    Sigh. Blag's experiment sure worked too though. Unsupprising results as well.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Teh_Gerbil wrote:
    Himself?

    So was it racism, or reverse psychology?

    And why on earth is that funny, have I missed a gag somewhere - little britain or something?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote:
    It was a little experiment to see who would get all self righteous on me - surprise surprise it was dis and Mat - people not usually known for giving a shit about racism.

    But the experiment goes the same way and until you admitted you reported how was anyone to know whether you were being silent because you don't see anti-semitism as a problem or because you felt you were conducting an interesting social experiment.

    As an aside I've seen both Mat and Dis condem racism and the far right
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote:
    It was a little experiment to see who would get all self righteous on me - surprise surprise it was dis and Mat - people not usually known for giving a shit about racism.

    Plenty of other regular posters and people who'd posted in this thread were silent. Nobody got 'self righteous' on you, nobody criticised the silence of specific individuals.

    Oh and that bullshit 'experiment' excuse doesn't really wash. And for the record I am as appalled by racism as any other decent person. (Not that pointing out the truth will stop your continued unfounded and untrue claims).
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    These days people are only racist if they know they can get away with it or they are off their tits.
    Also, Signor Gerbil, it's not politically correct to say coloured anymore, you gotta say black or white or asian, whatever... ;)
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Teh_Gerbil wrote:
    Turloug does go on the wind up when drunk. And he sure gets the response he looked for! Ah, some of you expect everyone to immediatley post "OMFG RACISTS?!!?!>!" when he does it. Doesn't a silent "report" do enough?

    Sigh. Blag's experiment sure worked too though. Unsupprising results as well.

    No, silence doesn't do shit. But lets people get away with their bulshit and disgusting ways.
    I thought that by now it was ingrained in every kid's mind that you do not let thing pass by keeping silent.
    By now Niemöller is considered a cliche, but maybe you - and many others - should after all, look up his words.

    And funnily enough - Blagsta did his experiment, I did mine.
    Lack of words, or your treassured silence, was appaling. And the worst thing is, that by now I know that should I have replied to the original words, then my concerns would have been brushed over just like Disillusioned and Matadore's replies were, based solely on our political convictions.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Plenty of other regular posters and people who'd posted in this thread were silent. Nobody got 'self righteous' on you, nobody criticised the silence of specific individuals.

    Oh and that bullshit 'experiment' excuse doesn't really wash. And for the record I am as appalled by racism as any other decent person. (Not that pointing out the truth will stop your continued unfounded and untrue claims).

    Yes dis, whatever you want to believe. Keep fooling yourself, you don't fool anyone else.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Dear Wendy wrote:

    And funnily enough - Blagsta did his experiment, I did mine.
    Lack of words, or your treassured silence, was appaling.

    Thing is, you have no idea who reported the post.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote:
    Thing is, you have no idea who reported the post.

    Thing is I don't fucking care who reported or didn't. I care about who spoke up. Cause frankly, I'm not the biggest fan of reporting posts - I believe in open discussion.

    And again, your experiment doesn't prove shit. Just proves that some people here are not consistent with their supposed principles, and that others are ignored and belittled in whatever context it may be because of their political views. So, care to remind me how your "experiment" proved succesful - apart from showing that most people here are ignorant assholes?
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