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Chelsea tractors to be charged £25 congestion charge

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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    The only ones not paying are a number of embassies. Which should have their cars taken away and crushed.

    Diplomats are under no obligation to pay. Charging embassy staff is in violation of the 1961 Vienna Convention, which bars the taxing of foreign diplomatic staff.

    The congestion charge has had at best mixed results. It might have reduced traffic within the congestion charge zone but as anybody who drives around London will know traffic has got significantly worse in areas just outside the zone.

    Tbh most people hate driving in London hence only drive when it is absolutely necessary, or at least that's how I am...The congestion charge and this latest increase for 4x4s seems like a headline grabbing lazy way for our buffoon of a Mayor to appear as if he is doing something. More than anything we need improved national rail links into central London - as well as the criminally overdue Crossrail and vastly improved services on the LU. And singling out 4x4s seems like a bit of opportunistic persecution - unless I'm wrong in thinking that a Rav4 will have to pay £25 but a Bentley won't.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    migpilot wrote:
    Public transport is shit in London

    :eek2:

    I think it's a crap idea because it won't make much difference. Well, it might if they're poor and driving a 4x4, but that's it.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Diplomats are under no obligation to pay. Charging embassy staff is in violation of the 1961 Vienna Convention, which bars the taxing of foreign diplomatic staff.
    So if they want to fill up with petrol, do they get it for 20p a litre or something? And cigarettes for £1.00 a pack?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    So if they want to fill up with petrol, do they get it for 20p a litre or something? And cigarettes for £1.00 a pack?

    No because VAT/duty are indirect taxes.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    No because VAT/duty are indirect taxes.
    And the congestion charge? Isn't it just like a bridge toll?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    Taxis are public transport. They offer an essential service.

    So, one bloke in a taxi is "public transport", me taking my kid to school is a car journey?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    And the congestion charge? Isn't it just like a bridge toll?

    Debatable, it's not something that is clear-cut in law but like a lot of the embassies I'd call it a tax.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Diplomats are under no obligation to pay. Charging embassy staff is in violation of the 1961 Vienna Convention, which bars the taxing of foreign diplomatic staff.
    Shame then that the CC is not a tax.

    When British diplomats are given free passage through toll highways abroad foreign diplomats here might have a case to claim they should be exempt. But that doesn't quite happen does it.

    The congestion charge has had at best mixed results. It might have reduced traffic within the congestion charge zone but as anybody who drives around London will know traffic has got significantly worse in areas just outside the zone.
    The solution is simple then- extend the charging zone.
    Tbh most people hate driving in London hence only drive when it is absolutely necessary, or at least that's how I am...The congestion charge and this latest increase for 4x4s seems like a headline grabbing lazy way for our buffoon of a Mayor to appear as if he is doing something. More than anything we need improved national rail links into central London - as well as the criminally overdue Crossrail and vastly improved services on the LU. And singling out 4x4s seems like a bit of opportunistic persecution - unless I'm wrong in thinking that a Rav4 will have to pay £25 but a Bentley won't.
    Well I work in Chelsea and I can assure you the local Sloanes don't hate driving around at all. On the contrary, there is nothing they appear to like more than to drive all of 1.2 miles to pick up Talluah and Christina from school in their 5.0 Range Rover Vogue. To the point where more and more schools are having to ask them not to park outside the school, or even better not to use their 3 tonne monster truck for the school run at all.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    The idea of a taxi is exactly the same one as that of a bus or a tube train: to discourage peoeple from using their own vehicles.

    Are hired limos puiblic transport?

    If not, why not?

    And that's even before we take MoK's point about road space and pollution.
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    JsTJsT Posts: 18,268 Skive's The Limit
    Taxi's are Public Transport - they are open and available to the general public. Dont agree with this crap that they reduce congestion - irrespective of whether people drive in or take a taxi its still a car on the road.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    So are stretch limos.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kermit wrote:
    Are hired limos puiblic transport?

    If not, why not?
    For the same reason a hired circus elephant would not be classed as public transport.

    They are luxuries, impractical and ill-suited to be used in a city centre with any frequency.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    JsT wrote:
    Taxi's are Public Transport - they are open and available to the general public. Dont agree with this crap that they reduce congestion - irrespective of whether people drive in or take a taxi its still a car on the road.
    Apart of course for the one in five cars that at any one time are looking for parking space and going round in circles.

    If all cars that go into central London could simply drive into a reserve parking space there would be 20% less traffic around. But the immense majority of them do not have a reserved parking space. So taxis do reduce congestion by cutting up on the number of private vehicles driven into town.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    For the same reason a hired circus elephant would not be classed as public transport.

    They are luxuries, impractical and ill-suited to be used in a city centre with any frequency.

    But a taxi isn't a luxury compared to the bus, tube or walking?

    Right-o.

    A taxi is a private vehicle hired to transport someone in comfort. It is exactly the same as a limo, only cheaper and less comfortable.

    And you are still to explain how one person in a taxi doesn't cause congestion, but one person in a Land Rover (which has the same footprint as a London cab) does.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I wouldn't call it a luxury though. It is better than the alternatives, but then something has always got to be better than something else. It is impossible for everything to be of the same quality.

    And as I have explained twice before, seeing as 1 in 5 cars circulating in city centres are doing so in the hope of finding a parking space, taxis cut congestion by eliminating the need for people to bring their own cars into town and spend half an hour going round in circles hoping to find a space.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    I wouldn't call it a luxury though.

    Taxis are for people going out on the lash who can't be bothered with nightbuses, and for business people who haven't driven to the city they're in.

    Taxis are a private means of transport, privately transporting people in private comfort for a fee.

    That is exactly what a hired limousine is.

    I'm not saying taxis don't serve a purpose, but they are not a fundamental part of the nation's public transport system. As such, they should pay the congestion charge.
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