Home Politics & Debate
If you need urgent support, call 999 or go to your nearest A&E. To contact our Crisis Messenger (open 24/7) text THEMIX to 85258.
Read the community guidelines before posting ✨
Options

Somlia: Islamists Capture town

2»

Comments

  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    Well it certainly wasn't for the weapons of mass desctruction that weren't there, the links to terrorism that didn't exist or the human right abuses the US has never cared one bit about...

    No but do you really believe that it was for oil as the No.1 motivation?
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Because:

    1) They don't have the resources

    2) They believe in the rule of law and don't think invading countries at will without UN approval should be done


    Not everyone is a trigger-happy cowboy you know...
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    Regime change: why?

    War on terror: don't make me laugh. Iraq had nothing to do with terrorism, and by going in they have made things infinitely worse, not better.

    WMD: LOL x 94,000,000,000,000,000

    Evil ideology: that be the same one the Americans were supporting for decades, and are indeed supporting in countless other countries around the world. I don't hear you complaining about Uzbekistan or Saudi Arabia. I wonder why that could be...
    Resgime as it was seen as a easier target than most other countries.

    War on terror can mean nasty resgiumes too which many like Jordans resgime symphaise with terrorists.

    As you keep saying... U.S has the evil ideology and not the Islamic terrorists... yeah right. wake up.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Sorry opps.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    it's oil and a foothold in the area.
    have you any idea how much energy we use in the west ...how demand is accelerating?

    then we have asia ...you don't believe the american admin were sitting at home watching pipelines and highways being built connecting iran and china as a none threatening situation as regard our energy and economic situations do you?
    of course the americans don't mind one bit that all the worlds resources are heading east along with the oil ...but they worry so much about human rights in iraq they'll spend billions and give of their young mens lives to free those people ....
    What hell else can it be about?

    America is more than capable of buying oil like anyone else without the need for an expensive, politically dangerous and internationally unpopular war.

    Has the Iraq war meant that oil is cheaper, or better available to the US only, or more secure?

    The answer is no to all of those, so how was it 'about the oil'?

    Or did they just do it worng?
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Toadborg wrote:
    No but do you really believe that it was for oil as the No.1 motivation?
    It could be... I certainly believe if the oil didn't exist there would have been no invasion.

    It's probably fair to say that one or two other aspects had to be there for the invasion to take place... namely the geographical position of Iraq and the necessity, once Sadam had turned on his masters, to reinstate a puppet regime in the region.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Toadborg wrote:
    America is more than capable of buying oil like anyone else without the need for an expensive, politically dangerous and internationally unpopular war.

    Has the Iraq war meant that oil is cheaper, or better available to the US only, or more secure?

    The answer is no to all of those, so how was it 'about the oil'?

    Or did they just do it worng?
    it would be very easy to turn this around ...if they went to fight terrorism ...how come the terrorist situation is now far worse?
    the so called war on terror has now made iraq and the world a much more dangerous place. or did they just do it wrong?
    they are building permanent huge super fortresses ...they will militarily dominate the region ...for energy needs.
    seeing as saddam with his very secular and westernised nation ...with it's night clubs and mini skirts and alcohol ...was the best weapon we had in the region against exteme religous views ...what else could we possibly be there for other than oil and a strategic stranglehold?
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    Because:

    1) They don't have the resources

    2) They believe in the rule of law and don't think invading countries at will without UN approval should be done

    Not everyone is a trigger-happy cowboy you know...

    I'd say it has a lot more to do with them not wanting to be unpopular with the voters.

    France not invading Iraq isnt a noble jesture, its just politicians saving their jobs.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    luke88 wrote:
    War on terror can mean nasty resgiumes too which many like Jordans resgime symphaise with terrorists.
    What on earth are you talking about?

    How exactly is Jordan's regime 'nasty'?

    Are you aware that Jordan is arguably the biggest and friendliest Arab ally of the US in the entire world?

    Christ...
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    what else could we possibly be there for other than oil and a strategic stranglehold?

    About $200bn worth of construction and military contacts?
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    bongbudda wrote:
    I'd say it has a lot more to do with them not wanting to be unpopular with the voters.

    France not invading Iraq isnt a noble jesture, its just politicians saving their jobs.
    To a degree, but I genuinely doubt France would want to invade Iraq or anyone else.

    Willing to engage in wars is something most people resent and try to avoid unless is absolutely necessary.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    Because:

    1) They don't have the resources

    2) They believe in the rule of law and don't think invading countries at will without UN approval should be done


    Not everyone is a trigger-happy cowboy you know...

    reason 1 may be accurate. reason 2 - you're having a laff aren't you???? Before making statements like that it may be worth having a look at the French record in International Affairs, especially intervention (and lack of it) in Africa.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    It could be... I certainly believe if the oil didn't exist there would have been no invasion.

    But in what way has the US gained with regards to oil?

    Is it chepaer, or more easily available, or more secure?

    To my understanding none of these is true, and certainly not worth the expense of the war. Imagine how much oil they used fighting the war for a start.......
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    NQA wrote:
    reason 1 may be accurate. reason 2 - you're having a laff aren't you???? Before making statements like that it may be worth having a look at the French record in International Affairs, especially intervention (and lack of it) in Africa.
    I have, and I fail to see how putting a few dozen soldiers on the ground to control a volatile situation compares with dropping 100,000 tons of high explosives in an area.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Toadborg wrote:
    But in what way has the US gained with regards to oil?

    Is it chepaer, or more easily available, or more secure?
    It's controlled by them. And it's traded in US dollars.

    Many believe the final push for the US to go to war was Saddam having the temerity to start trading in euros.
    To my understanding none of these is true, and certainly not worth the expense of the war. Imagine how much oil they used fighting the war for a start.......
    I would imagine the totality of the oil they have used in the war amounts to approximately 1/10 billionth part of Iraq's reserves.

    Do not underestimate the importance of the US controlling the oil in Iraq and having a springboard from which to jump on any other oil-rich neighbouring countries that don't dance to the US' tune.

    The Americans certainly didn't miss it.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    The French will always jump in and intervene to their own benefit but waging war on Iraq or Iran is not to their benefit as they had contracts with those countries and it is more profitable to do as they did rather then with military force.

    Look at the French record, they dont mind intervening to saving their own but let everyone else suffer and be slaughtered. They dont mind killing on mass to get what they want, they just dont do it if there isnt a good enough profit to be made.

    Finally, Somalia is not yet a sovereign state is it? I think it is still under dispute and has no working Government only Guerillas and various militias under warlords. There for Somalia is probably the one country any other nation can invade freely, not that they would as their is nothing to be gained from it, except imposing peace on the region by force and disarming the warlords in place, but that would cost too many lives anyway.
  • Options
    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    subject13 wrote:
    The French will always jump in and intervene to their own benefit but waging war on Iraq or Iran is not to their benefit as they had contracts with those countries and it is more profitable to do as they did rather then with military force.

    Look at the French record, they dont mind intervening to saving their own but let everyone else suffer and be slaughtered. They dont mind killing on mass to get what they want, they just dont do it if there isnt a good enough profit to be made.
    I'm not sure what are you referring to there. Just about every country in the world would do an 'extraction' if their citizens are in a very volatile situation- and in fact most countries that can, have done so.

    That's quite different from mounting a pre-emptive, aggresive, unjustified full-scale war isn't it?
  • Options
    Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Posts: 13,332 Born on Earth, Raised by The Mix
    Sorry why are you debating Iraq now? Iraq was invaded for three main reasons:

    1) To establish a US presence in the Mid East - right near Iran.
    2) Oils!
    3) A show of US force to stike fear into the hearts of their enemies "Shock and Awe" - which became more Shock and Awe over how porley this plan worked.

    But yes, we aren't in the Sudan either - but we should be. Africa needs our help far more than the relativley stable (before we arrived) Mid East does. It's in a right mess, parts of Africa - the Mid East wasn't until the troops arrived.
Sign In or Register to comment.