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New drug regulations - a step backwards?

JadedJaded back for morePosts: 2,682
The full article is in today's Guardian. The upshot is that the Home Office are proposing to slash the limits for posession, while the Advisory Committee on the Misuse of Drugs are warning this could impact severly on the ability of the police to enforce the regulations.

What does everyone think of that? Any theories on why they have taken such action, when the Advisory Committe recommendations seemed to indicate moving to less regulation? Be interested to know what everyone thinks...

Comments

  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    It's madness, could you imagine go to jail 14years for 5g of weed...
    It's like that guy in the state that went to jail for 10 years for 2 spliffs, but that was ages ago... You would thought we would evolve a bit instead of going backward...
    Also from what I ca understand those are just plans and suggestions and need to be accepted before they can be put in place...
  • JadedJaded back for more Posts: 2,682
    Also from what I ca understand those are just plans and suggestions and need to be accepted before they can be put in place...
    That's right, at the moment they still have to go through parliament.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    LadyJade wrote:
    That's right, at the moment they still have to go through parliament.

    Fingers crossed then...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Also I dont understand how they were allowing 500g of weed as compared to 133g of resin saying as weed is stronger

    They mean herbal cannabis, leaves and such like, not sensi.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    And also good cannabis resin can be way stronger than weed...
    Weed is generally stronger cos the resin you get easily is crap...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    The limits are actually a side issue, what is far far more important about this proposal regardless of the limits is the presumption of guilt.

    If you are caught holding over the limit it will be presumed you are a dealer and you will have to prove in court that you are not. This is vile.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    How exactly does a non-dealer go about prooving that they're not a dealer?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    katralla wrote:
    How exactly does a non-dealer go about prooving that they're not a dealer?

    In short, they dont. Not unless they can afford a decent lawyer.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    it's the usual farce.
    in 1968 the wooton comittee ...set up by the government ...recomended a relaxing of the drug laws ...based on the medical and ethical issues.
    the government did exactly the opposite.
    it's a mess. it's very confusing. it's an admission of failure and incompetence.

    did anyone see the docu last night about parliament and alcohol?
    very interesting ...this country is basicly run by a load of piss heads from the countries biggest pub.
    it seems the only thing they can get right ...is running a piss up in a brewery.
    i think it's time we locked them all up ...and threw away the key.
  • JadedJaded back for more Posts: 2,682
    There is plenty of information on the Transform website about what you can do if you disagree with what the government proposes - have a look at the Transform Action Guide for the page.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    LadyJade wrote:
    There is plenty of information on the Transform website about what you can do if you disagree with what the government proposes - have a look at the Transform Action Guide for the page.

    Yeah, I'd like to have even the slightest faith in the government listening too.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    The Government being ambigious on their drug policies! Well I never! :yeees:
  • JadedJaded back for more Posts: 2,682
    bongbudda wrote:
    Yeah, I'd like to have even the slightest faith in the government listening too.

    Yeah well its better than sitting around on your ass whinging about it, innit. If everyone who had an opinion could be bothered to do something about it, things would be a lot more likely to change.
  • Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Stalin's Organist Posts: 13,327
    That just getting silly now. Soon you'll only be able to carry a ten bag. Fuckers.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fuck 'em, it's not gonna stop anybody and the amount of people that get caught and blamed as dealers will be unreal. It will be a massive waste of police time and in the end I think the idea would go kaput anyway because you'd have nearly everyone caught with cannabis tagged a dealer and sent down. Bollocks.

    Dealers should only be dealers if A- they are caught in the act. or B- If they have a very large amount in seperate bags or cut up.

    I've known people to buy 9 bars just for fuckin smoke coz of the amount of money you can save yourself, know what I mean? What a joke our government is, and I'd say we definately have one of the most lenient. It's a pretty sick world we live in.

    I'd be much more bothered about stopping drunken fights/rioting clearly a lot of this would not happen if it were not for people getting pissed out their faces. Also, your house is getting broken into and coppers come 4hours later or the next day! What the fucks that about! And you can get time for carrying a bit of gange. :eek2:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    In an era in which the home office is under attack for blunderous handlings regarding law and order, being seen to be `tough on drugs` is something which will play well in the media.

    Taking more progressive measures at this time wouldnt be conducive to good rosey opinion polls.
    LJ
    If everyone who had an opinion could be bothered to do something about it, things would be a lot more likely to change.

    the most plainly insightful thing thats been said on here in ages.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    LadyJade wrote:
    Yeah well its better than sitting around on your ass whinging about it, innit. If everyone who had an opinion could be bothered to do something about it, things would be a lot more likely to change.

    I fucking do try and do something about it, I'm not just an armchair critic, but what real bloody difference is it going to make. As Martin says, this is about headlines and bugger the real human cost.

    There is no good news, we're all doomed.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    yeah I second that, to be honest i think that comment could easily be taken out of context LJ. Plenty of us do have opinions AND do stuff, i dont think you meant it as such but i think it could be taken that way.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    bongbudda wrote:
    I'm not just an armchair critic, but what real bloody difference is it going to make.
    .
    the trouble is ...your right there.
    the incompetence and the political football games are absolutely shocking.
    would ciba giegy be allowed to operate like this ...or boots or ici?
    i think not.
    it doesn't seem to matter what evidence or advice is given ... it's as if they have taken to tossing a coin.
    they certainly aren't listening to us.
    us is the people who are about to be criminalised all over again.
    ever harsher controls ...for what exactly?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fantastic way to use up police resources which should be going elsewhere. :banghead:


    Out of interest does anyone have a link to information on what constitutes personal for most of the mainstream substances?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Don't want to sound like a defeatist cunt here but getting up off your hole and doing something about it will do fuck all! Because for every vote a party can gain by changing the drug laws to suit us they'll lose 10,000 from the general public. No matter how much you tell the public the truth they won't listen, it's all "drugs are bad bla bla bla." The Government want votes, not truth.
  • JadedJaded back for more Posts: 2,682
    yeah I second that, to be honest i think that comment could easily be taken out of context LJ. Plenty of us do have opinions AND do stuff, i dont think you meant it as such but i think it could be taken that way.

    I did mean it as such, there are a lot who do sit and moan, and say it doesn't make any difference and that really pisses me off.

    The ones who I admire are the ones like buddah, who are realistic abut how much difference it could make but try anyway, because they have the strength of their convictions and think that doing something is better than doing nothing. Its the rest of the slackers who belive it should be different but can't be arsed who let everyone else down. Its no wonder everyone feels cynical about it though.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    5g's??? That's fuckin ridicoulous. 28 sounds a bit more like it. But still, it's fuckin weed for gods sake! And even if it were something that'd kill you in a second, what right do they have to tell us not to take it????
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Change IS happening, even if it’s not widespread legalization as some would unrealistically prefer. Cases are not handled to the fullest extent they could be and in many cases arrests are downgraded – even on subsequent offenses. The more people who speak up calmly and rationally – the faster change canl happen. It will never be perfect and make both sides happy, but minimizing the penalties and jail time is a step in a direction that many people in the government actually support (at least on this side of the ocean). While laws have to be upheld, I think all the openness IS having an impact and I admire The Site for providing a forum in which intelligent people can speak (type?) openly for others to ponder. I think America owes a lot to the other countries (and the people behind the efforts) that have forced us to look in the mirror with so many politicians and conservative public figures owning up to drug problems. Even for people who despise drugs – the penal system is becoming seen as an inappropriate solution.

    No system is perfect, but change can be effected over time. Remember, the majority of people have tried illicit drugs at some point so the biggest hurdle is overcoming hypocrisy. One step at a time...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    CuzICare wrote:
    Change IS happening, even if it’s not widespread legalization as some would unrealistically prefer. Cases are not handled to the fullest extent they could be and in many cases arrests are downgraded – even on subsequent offenses. The more people who speak up calmly and rationally – the faster change canl happen. It will never be perfect and make both sides happy, but minimizing the penalties and jail time is a step in a direction that many people in the government actually support (at least on this side of the ocean). While laws have to be upheld, I think all the openness IS having an impact and I admire The Site for providing a forum in which intelligent people can speak (type?) openly for others to ponder. I think America owes a lot to the other countries (and the people behind the efforts) that have forced us to look in the mirror with so many politicians and conservative public figures owning up to drug problems. Even for people who despise drugs – the penal system is becoming seen as an inappropriate solution.

    No system is perfect, but change can be effected over time. Remember, the majority of people have tried illicit drugs at some point so the biggest hurdle is overcoming hypocrisy. One step at a time...
    trouble here in the uk is ...the powers that be are talking about taking us backwards.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    if this becomes law.........................there will be blood
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    A step backwards without a doubt. That means someone like me who sometimes buy's a fairly large amount of weed to smoke with friends could end up facing dealer charges when it's purely for personal use!

    I've always thought that the police/government were absolutely clueless about drugs because I remember someone around here got caught with a few plants in his shed that he grew for personal use. He got locked up (can't remember how long for).. & then in the same year a heroin addict who's pretty well known used to rob and steal to fund his habit.. what was his sentence? 8 months in a rehabilitation centre.

    Great decision making there eh?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aspire wrote:
    A step backwards without a doubt. That means someone like me who sometimes buy's a fairly large amount of weed to smoke with friends could end up facing dealer charges when it's purely for personal use!
    Yeah it is just fuckin ridiculous they can and will lock up perfectly good people cuz they like to get high with friends.
    The only people to get locked up should be ones that are a danger to others.
    Just the other day I'd bought an 8th for me and an 8th each for 3 of my friends. I wouldn't hurt a fly yet i probably coulda been put away for afew years as that would be considered dealing. Really I'm just doing my friends a favour! It's totally harmless to everyone except the people that smoke it, and my friends choose to smoke it, so why the fuck should I get locked away?!
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Just the other day I'd bought an 8th for me and an 8th each for 3 of my friends. I wouldn't hurt a fly yet i probably coulda been put away for afew years as that would be considered dealing. Really I'm just doing my friends a favour! It's totally harmless to everyone except the people that smoke it, and my friends choose to smoke it, so why the fuck should I get locked away?!

    I should actually point out that that is dealing, whether you are getting it for mates and doing it for no profit makes no difference. Whether or not you deserve jail time is another matter altogether but you are dealing.

    What is most disturbing about this is the way it will make virtually all cannabis users dealers in the eyes of the law. Anything above an 1/8th and you're buggered.
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