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Mladic soon to be caught...

Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
Mladic, Bosnian-Serb Paramilitary leader and butcher of Srebreniczka is apparently nearing capture by, i believe, Serb security forces.

I welcome the news, if it is true. But I do fear for what will happen afterwards. Will the trial be held by the EU, will the Serbs keep a hold of him, or will his enemies demand custody?

The point is i think his arrest and trial should be by the numbers, so justice can be brought about. And this should not be a case of the Anti-Serb movement making political or media gains.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I really hope the bastard is caught.

    I think the best way would be for him to be tried at The Hague. That's how it should be with all war criminals anyway. Even they have a right to a fair trial, and in most cases they won't be getting that in the country where they have committed their crimes.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    He's going to end up in The Hague - I hope they make him share a cell with Slobo and the toilet breaks.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    I really hope the bastard is caught.

    I think the best way would be for him to be tried at The Hague. That's how it should be with all war criminals anyway. Even they have a right to a fair trial, and in most cases they won't be getting that in the country where they have committed their crimes.

    I agree with you Aladdin 100%
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    Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Posts: 13,332 Born on Earth, Raised by The Mix
    Aladdin wrote:
    I really hope the bastard is caught.

    I think the best way would be for him to be tried at The Hague. That's how it should be with all war criminals anyway. Even they have a right to a fair trial, and in most cases they won't be getting that in the country where they have committed their crimes.

    Yeah, but it is likley he wil be tried at home.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Still not caught - is this all media hype?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    If he is tried at home he will be let off, if home means Serbia, in a Serb court near Bosnia. A trial by neutrals is key to keeping all sides calm i think.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Aladdin wrote:
    I think the best way would be for him to be tried at The Hague. That's how it should be with all war criminals anyway. Even they have a right to a fair trial, and in most cases they won't be getting that in the country where they have committed their crimes.
    Wait a minute. One slight problem with that. Remember the Slobodan Milosevic trial? It's degenerated into a farce that's going on and on forever. Just sentence him to death and be done with it. I wish they could...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    To be fair on Milosevic, he has a point in court about his trial. After all, the crimes he is accused of commiting happened, then he was allowed by the entire West and UN to continue in power, we totally didnt go in to arrest him or demand he be turned over. The only thing he was deposed for was election rigging and the UN got in the back door by scaring the new regime with threats of sanctions if Milosevic wasnt turned over, so in fear they handed him over. Surely, for the sake of legitimacy we should have demanded he be handed over from the start.

    The thing with these modern day dictators is they have learned well from Nuremberg, they dont give the judges a chance to talk or the prosecution to make a case and they try to defend themselves to make a show of it.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I find the whole thing to be ludicrous.

    Everything every dictator does is legal, that's the whole fucking problem. As long as people believe in the rule of law and not their own common fucking sense you'll keep having dictators and all that goes with it.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    Everything every dictator does is legal, that's the whole fucking problem. As long as people believe in the rule of law and not their own common fucking sense you'll keep having dictators and all that goes with it.
    Explain, please...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Legal = "people in charge" opinions, written down and backed by violence.

    Theft is wrong, unless it's legal. Then it's taxation.

    Murder is wrong, unless it's legal. Then it's execution.

    Most of the horrors inflicted by perfectly rational people against their victims has been done in the name of the rule of law. Everything Hitler did was legal.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    It is only illegal when it is against another country, correct?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    It is only illegal when it is against another country, correct?

    I'd love for you to provide me with some proof that would pass the rules of evidence of a court that countries exist. Best of luck!
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    I'd love for you to provide me with some proof that would pass the rules of evidence of a court that countries exist. Best of luck!
    Oh, yeah i forgot you didnt believe in countries or nations. But then i wouldn't have to prove they exist in court, the courts would just accept it as a given!
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Oh, yeah i forgot you didnt believe in countries or nations. But then i wouldn't have to prove they exist in court, the courts would just accept it as a given!

    Oh no mate. Prosecution has to prove jurisdiction. ;)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    Oh no mate. Prosecution has to prove jurisdiction. ;)

    Which judging from the number of people in jail they seem to do quite nicely.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Yep, since jurisdiction is proven so easily, that surely proves the courts at least believe in nations and boundaries and boarders.

    Ironic yet again, for the Bosnian war was all about boarders and control and rights to secession.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Which judging from the number of people in jail they seem to do quite nicely.

    If you don't bring it up, it's assumed you submit to it. Over here you have to raise issues of jurisdiction before the trial. (I think it's two weeks) ;)

    As most people mistake the idea of being within the country (or indeed town, city etc) for reality almost no one does raise the issue.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    So its like what? 10 years or more since the end of the Bosnian conflict and we are only just about to have Mladic in custody now?

    And people think its ludicruos we don't have Osama by now.

    I mean 10 years and we havent got Mladic. Surely Osama has a few years left.

    Anyway, I am glad they are gonna get him. I reckon the tiral should be internation based with neutral judges and so forth. Couldn't trust the serbs to deal with him.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Couldnt trust the Bosniaks, Croats or anyone in the Balkans to deal with him!
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    that is true.

    But then who else is left? The americans? Where everyone will bitch and moan about it? The rest of europe? They ain't even done with Milosevic yet! The Chinese? That would eb just hypocritical.

    There is no one left that could do it!
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    America couldnt because they are biased anyway! They demonised the Serbs and made them the enemy, when they should have been trying to be neautral and bring about the peace.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    No, no and no and no.

    its not unusual to share the same opinion as someone you know. We don't all have to argue like you and me scarlett ;)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I think you will find Scarlett that despite our agreement and similar views, we often deviate greatly and MY typing AND spelling are far, far, far better then Walkindudes!

    Also, i am sure Walkindude as an Australian, a country that openly took in many refugees of the Bosnian War from Croatia would feel more of a connection with them. I by contrast find the demonisation of the Serbs in the conflict to be a bad thing and despise the actions of Croatia, as they have acted as though they were innocent victims due to how the war was portrayed, rather then having the truth of the conflict shown.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    My typing is only such because I generally don't have masses of time on the net and I don't carefully serch through every line for typos. I do know how to spell, if you notice man of my mistakes are simple typos, like I was typing fast and the space got put in the wrong place or the word as the right letters but are slightly mixed up!

    Indeed. I am more on the Bosnian and Croats side then the Serbs, and while I am sure some things were left out in the portrayal of the conflcit and that both sides commited some deplorable acts,, I would still say its the Serbs that were in the wrong.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    How can the Serbs be in the wrong when they were provoked into the war by Sedition? The Croat Government (Holocaust denying, ethnic cleansing, Racists, Nazi lovers) were openly arming their defense forces for the purposes of attacking the JNA (Yugoslav national army) and driving them from their boarders! The JNA was a neutral army for the whole country and it was not, as revisionist historians say, a puppet of Milosevic until AFTER the Croats move.

    The truth is, more Serb civilians were slaughtered in the Bosnian war then any other side, with the exception of the Bosniaks...who i remind you were predominantly favouring Serbia and the majority were Serb/Slavic.

    They were demonised by a compliant world media who refused to investigate the facts or were denied the opportunity to investigate the facts, and aided in making the Serbs a scapegoat for a war that came about due to Serbia been unhappy with the Croat nomination for the rotating Presidency, Muslim extremists demanding all non-Muslims be removed from Bosnia so it could be a muslim state and Croatian military build up.

    The only reason Serbia was not the wests ally was because they were inherently an ally of the USSR and then later Russia and Communist at a time when Fascist mass murdered like the Croat leader were acceptable but communists were not!
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Yugoslavia wasn't an ally of the USSR - despite them both being communist. It wasn't a member of the Warsaw Pact and had always made clear it would fight them if they were invaded (and do the same towards NATO) on the other side.

    However, the Serbs weren't the innocents you make out. All three sides committed atrocities and took part in ethnic cleansing (a rather polite term for murder and rape), but the Serbs were by far the worst.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Well this worked out well.
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