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Terrorist gets a pathetic 13 years.

Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
Even the most deluded far left terrorist sympathiser surely finds this sentence pathetic? I strongly dislike the way America is treating its terrorist suspects (either try them and execute them or let them go) but I think this is beyond a joke.

Shoebomb plotter gets 13 years

Shoebomb plotter Saajid Badat has been sentenced to 13 years in jail for planning to blow up a passenger plane.
The 25-year-old, of St James Street, Gloucester, was sentenced after conspiring with fellow Briton Richard Reid and a Tunisian man.

He pleaded guilty in February to the plot to blow up the transatlantic flight on its way to the US in 2001.

The judge at the Old Bailey said Badat could have been jailed for 50 years if he had not withdrawn from the plot.

Successful prosecution

The case is the first successful major terrorism prosecution in the UK since the 11 September attacks on the US.

The court was told that Badat had an identical device to the one that Reid tried to use on a flight from Paris to Miami in December 2001.

He had bought a ticket to fly from Manchester to Amsterdam on 17 December 2001, and then on to the United States. But he did not take the flight.

Police said Belgian telephone cards were used by both Reid and Badat to contact Nizar Trabelsi, a Tunisian who is now in jail in Belgium.

Trabelsi, a former professional football player, admitted planning to drive a carbomb into the canteen of a Belgian air base where US nuclear weapons are believed to be stored.

But an e-mail from Badat to his family on 14 December 2001 indicated he intended to withdraw from the plot.

Unlike Reid - who was jailed for life in the US after he attempted to detonate his device on a flight from Paris to Miami - the court was told how Badat could not face being a "courier of death".

He dismantled his shoebomb, which was specially designed to evade airport security, and rejected terrorism.

Judge Adrian Fulford said Badat had been a part of a "wicked and inhumane" plot, but believed he had had a "genuine change of heart".

"Turning away from crime in circumstances such as these constitutes a powerful mitigating factor," the judge added.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4474307.stm
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    He should be freed immediately.

    Two reasons -

    1) Prison is supposed to be about rehabilitation. He's already jacked the terrorism in so why lock him up?

    2) For any other crime you have to actually go through with it for it to be one. What we have in this case is akin to a bank robber who plans a raid but bottles it. Or perhaps you should get a car parking fine every time you think about leaving the car on double yellows, whether you do or not.

    No crime - no time.

    To quote Sideshow Bob - "They don't give Nobel prizes for attempted chemistry!"
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    He should be freed immediately.

    Two reasons -

    1) Prison is supposed to be about rehabilitation. He's already jacked the terrorism in so why lock him up?

    2) For any other crime you have to actually go through with it for it to be one. What we have in this case is akin to a bank robber who plans a raid but bottles it. Or perhaps you should get a car parking fine every time you think about leaving the car on double yellows, whether you do or not.

    No crime - no time.

    To quote Sideshow Bob - "They don't give Nobel prizes for attempted chemistry!"


    Trying to piss me off ? Thanks for the laugh.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock, there are such crimes as attempted perjury, as you get founf out so it didnt work

    attempted fraud

    intent to commit a criminal offence etc
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    No. An attempted crime is one that you try and fail at because you are caught halfway through.

    In this case, if he had taken the shoe, armed it and then driven to the airport and got stopped getting on the plane then that would have been attempted terrorism. He didn't "attempt" anything he just talked about it with someone and when it came time to go through with it he bottled it.

    The most he is guilty of is having a potential explosive in his house. Along with everyone else who has some fertilizer sugar etc.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Don't be daft Klintock, his intent is not in question here. If he'd had a butane lighter (which is still allowed under security rules) he'd have succeeded. Point is that he didn't actually achieve anything which is why this sentance is so 'low'.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Actually klintock has a very valid point, friend. Your suggestion has no merit since it wasnt for lack of anything that he did not go through with it, he simply decided against it. Thus, as klintock pointed out, no crime was actually commited.

    This is just another example of the growing acceptance of a paradigm of authoritarian control being ingrained in the public consciousness through repeated fearmongering and uncritical media compliance, for easily exploitable air-time profit, with the renewed fascist status quo.

    As people sheepishly accept these so called "Anti-terror" laws and inflated myths of terrorists behind every lamppost, the police state aparatus grows increasingly entrenched until one day, all the smug little "it can't happen here" and "my government would never do anything to harm its own citizens" types wake up to the same reality their counterparts in 1930's Germany faced.

    This time round, however, the fascists have begun the resurgence in the mecca of PR imaging and hyper military technology, so don't expect any Yankee Doodle heros to help liberate Europea second time, theyre too busy solidifying the deals in favour of tyranny and increased arbitrary criminalisation.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Should have got a minimum of 25 years in a maximum security harsh regime prison, kept locked up 23 hrs a day and made to watch a continous loop of George W speeches.

    Typical mamby-pamby British sentencing. When are the judiciary going to wake up and get into the 21st century and realise theres a war on?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    The only war is that storm of conflicting notions raging in your head RK. The rest is merely the fabrication of the real criminals, who are steadily concentrating all power unto themselves and their corporate cronies on both sides of the Atlantic through lies, media misinformation and bogus "official" pronouncements (without any evidence to back them up).

    Funny, for one who claims to distrust anything Blair says or adheres to, you sure seem all too willing to swallow this archetypal lie hook line and sinker.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    If he'd had a butane lighter (which is still allowed under security rules) he'd have succeeded.

    If My Aunt Had Balls She’d Be My Uncle.

    They are going to put him in prison for thirteen years to teach him a lesson he learned all on his own already.

    The actions of fuckwits, frankly.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    The only war is that storm of conflicting notions raging in your head RK. The rest is merely the fabrication of the real criminals, who are steadily concentrating all power unto themselves and their corporate cronies on both sides of the Atlantic through lies, media misinformation and bogus "official" pronouncements (without any evidence to back them up).

    Funny, for one who claims to distrust anything Blair says or adheres to, you sure seem all too willing to swallow this archetypal lie hook line and sinker.
    I certainly wouldn't believe anything Phoney said. I do believe however more credible voices that warn that we are in the midst of an insidious, below the radar war, with forces that are out to destroy Western values and our democratic way of life. Because of the nature of this particular war there are many gullible fools out there that do not believe it exists.
    We must be ever vigilant and install high levels of security and introduce laws to protect us. Our society will, and has changed but that is the acceptable price we must pay.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I certainly wouldn't believe anything Phoney said. I do believe however more credible voices that warn that we are in the midst of an insidious, below the radar war, with forces that are out to destroy Western values and our democratic way of life. Because of the nature of this particular war there are many gullible fools out there that do not believe it exists.

    This sounds like an intro to a crap cop show or the equalizer or something.

    How does removing western values to fight a threat preserve those western values exactly? How do we get them back if "the war" is won?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Rich Kid wrote:
    I certainly wouldn't believe anything Phoney said.

    anything who said?
    I do believe however more credible voices that warn that we are in the midst of an insidious, below the radar war

    That may be true, but what crime did this man commit? He choce not to go through with it...
    Western values and our democratic way of life.

    You've used that expression before and was asked to explain what these values are, and what you mean by "democratic wauy of life". Can you do so now please?
    introduce laws to protect us.

    Such as?
    the acceptable price we must pay.

    What precisely is the "acceptable" price? How much freedom are you wiolling to forego inorder to protect "freedom"?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    anything who said?
    Phoney Blair.
    That may be true, but what crime did this man commit? He choce not to go through with it...
    We were lucky, lets make sure he's away for a long time to contemplate the evil of his ways so he doesn't get a second chance.
    You've used that expression before and was asked to explain what these values are, and what you mean by "democratic wauy of life". Can you do so now please?
    Our whole way of life in this country and the institutions that enable it to function.
    What precisely is the "acceptable" price? How much freedom are you wiolling to forego inorder to protect "freedom"?
    The "acceptable price" is anything that defeats the terrorists. I would be prepared to go to any lengths to ensure we win.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Rich Kid wrote:
    Phoney Blair.

    Nope, lost me. never heard of that person. Male or female?
    We were lucky, lets make sure he's away for a long time to contemplate the evil of his ways so he doesn't get a second chance.

    Have you kept up with the news and this thread. He's already got 13 years, so what do you mean by "Let's make sure he's away for a long time"?

    And...er... he doesnt't want a second chance and he didn't actually want his first either.
    Our whole way of life in this country and the institutions that enable it to function.

    Such as?
    The "acceptable price" is anything that defeats the terrorists. I would be prepared to go to any lengths to ensure we win.

    So, for example, you would be prepared to spend the rest of your life in prison, if it meant that the "terrorists" were beaten?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    So, for example, you would be prepared to spend the rest of your life in prison, if it meant that the "terrorists" were beaten?

    What kind of worthless snivelling excuse for a human would not be willing to spend the rest of their lives in prison if it prevented the deaths of thousands - possibly millions of innocent people from violent deaths because of a few evil terrorists?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    What kind of worthless snivelling excuse for a human would not be willing to spend the rest of their lives in prison if it prevented the deaths of thousands - possibly millions of innocent people from violent deaths because of a few evil terrorists?

    Excellent, please hand yourself in at the nearest police station.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    What kind of worthless snivelling excuse for a human would not be willing to spend the rest of their lives in prison if it prevented the deaths of thousands - possibly millions of innocent people from violent deaths because of a few evil terrorists?

    Nice reframe. Consider it stolen - >yoink<
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Rich Kid wrote:
    Should have got a minimum of 25 years in a maximum security harsh regime prison, kept locked up 23 hrs a day and made to watch a continous loop of George W speeches.

    Typical mamby-pamby British sentencing. When are the judiciary going to wake up and get into the 21st century and realise theres a war on?

    £27500 x 25 = £687500

    before inflation is taken into account.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    i'm an ex criminal.
    but i still have criminal thoughts.
    i notice certain movements of money and convince myself that if i wished ...i could quite easily intercept that money.
    some securicor systems are inviting me.
    some of the easiest and largest ammounts of cash criminaly available are supermarkets and securicor ...i'll go no further with the details but thats how MY mind works.
    being ex and completely reformed and now a respectable member of society doesn't stop me thinking about these things though.
    should i go to jail for thinking about it but deciding not to act on those thoughts?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    thought police
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    should i go to jail for thinking about it but deciding not to act on those thoughts?

    They might if you were sitting in a car with a shotgun and a baclava on your head.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    NQA wrote:
    They might if you were sitting in a car with a shotgun and a baclava on your head.
    indeed! :)
    i don't think any man could have a reasonable defence in that situation.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    indeed! :)
    i don't think any man could have a reasonable defence in that situation.
    Could try asking Klintock - I reckon he'd put an argument for it :thumb:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    LOL

    Ok - here goes -

    I wouldn't be guilty if i wasn't in the country at the time, right?

    And you base your allegations on facts?

    What, factually is a country?

    Always argue jurisdiction. Always.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    LOL

    Ok - here goes -

    I wouldn't be guilty if i wasn't in the country at the time, right?

    And you base your allegations on facts?

    What, factually is a country?

    Always argue jurisdiction. Always.
    :thumb: knew I could rely on you
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    klintock wrote:
    LOL


    What, factually is a country?

    Always argue jurisdiction. Always.
    what factualy is a supermarket carpark?
    i do worry about you ending up in hmp strangeworld klint with your deceptions of reality.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    what factualy is a supermarket carpark?

    Now you are getting it, Mr. Roll. :)

    Btw, as an alternative to continual drugs I can definitely advocate hypnosis. You only have to do each drug once and then go all trancey to get the "high" again. Even better, no side effects. :)
    i do worry about you ending up in hmp strangeworld klint with your deceptions of reality.

    Thanks for the concern.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    LOL. Its astoundingly clear from posts by RK or Born Slippy that the ingrained indoctrination of ideology has succeeded in supplanting all reason and critical thinking.

    The only "forces" out to "destroy OUR democratic way of life" are those in power doing precisely that by shredding civil liberties, introducing hefty surveillance states and indeed turning mere suspicion into punishable crime. The Nazis did no less!

    How soon the lessons of history are erased from the mind of a smug and self-satisfied populace to serve the political aspirations of elite powermongers and elite corporate interests of a rapidly expanding security industry (to say nothing of the longrunning traditional military industrial complex and intelligence services).

    Of course RK would be cheering for it, as he and his silver spoon lifestyle depend on the suppression of an increasingly (and when the oil really becomes scarce in several decades, "overwhelmingly") disenfranchised public. Of course he would blatantly defend the real criminals currently in power since they are all of the same cloth. Born Slippy's reasons one can only guess at.

    The wheel of history has come around full cycle and here we are on the threshhold of the Fourth Reich (read: New American Century, Pax Americana, New World Order, et al.) and just as with the last, any who dare oppose it are labelled "conspiracy theorists", "terrorists", or any other moniker deemed appropriate for the moment.

    In the end though, the scoffers will be silenced and shamed as they have been at the downfall of every previous grasp for power and control over liberty and accountability.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    LOL. Its astoundingly clear from posts by RK or Born Slippy that the ingrained indoctrination of ideology has succeeded in supplanting all reason and crticial thinking.

    The only "forces" out to "destroy OUR democratic way of life" are those in power doing precisely that by shredding civil liberties, introducing hefty surveillance states and indeed turning mere suspicion into punishable crime. The Nazis did no less!

    How soon the lessons of history are erased from the mind of a smug and self-satisfied populace to serve the political aspirations of elite powermongers and elite corporate interests of a rapidly expanding security industry (to say nothing of the longrunning traditional military industrial complex and intelligence services).

    Of course RK would be cheering for it, as he and his silver spoon lifestyle depend on the suppression of an increasingly (and when the oil really becomes scarce in several decades, "overwhelmingly") disenfranchised public. Of course he would blatantly defend the real criminals currently in power since they are all of the same cloth. Born Slippy's reasons one can only guess at.

    The wheel of history has come around full cycle and here we are on the threshhold of the Fourth Reich (read: New American Century, Pax Americana, New World Order, et al.) and just as with the last, any who dare oppose it are labelled "conspiracy theorists", "terrorists", or any other moniker deemed appropriate for the moment.

    In the end though, the scoffers will be silenced and shamed as they have been at the downfall of every previous grasp for power and control over liberty and accountability.

    I agree with everything you've just said.

    This 'terrorist threat' is being absurdly exaggerated to instill fear of the public in order to justify ever more serious breaches of civil liberties and human rights - such as Jack Straw's decision to allow the use of 'evidence' obtained through torture. And, yes, I dearly hope to see "Blackburn: IND GAIN" on the TV in the early hours of 6 May.

    What sort of democracy does Rich Kid think he is defending?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Tequila wrote:
    This 'terrorist threat' is being absurdly exaggerated to instill fear of the public


    The Madrid bombings, and the September 11th attacks have obviously slipped your memory.
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