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e, legalise it ?

i'm on currently on the phone to a mate and were discussing the finer aspects of legalising e, what do you guys reckon ? we've come up with the following advantages:-

1) control by the government would ensure safe pills, no rat poision if they do exsist that is !

2) taxation on licesend pills would make a tidy profit for the government, allowing increased spending on the nhs, education etc

3) education in schools would permit advice on things such as sensible dosage, water intake and the exact effects and medical background of an ecstsasy high

4) a greater understanding of exactly what ecsatsy is about for all concerned including the old folks

5) a reduction in crime on drug trafficking and 'dealer' crime

6) a dramatic reduction in alcohol related incidents such as domestic abuse, drink driving and youths brawling at 3 on a saturdat morning

7) a better society ??? i think we all agree pills ahve given us an improved outlook on life, making is generally more aware of the workings of life

anything to add ?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Yeh if it is legal, at least then I don't need to be panic everytime I carry pills inside my pocket <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/tongue.gif"&gt;
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Well i fundementaly disagree with the goverment policy of punishing people for puttign chemicals into theier own bodies. However I would still make sale illigal to prottect against dealers who presure young and Impressionable people into becoming dependant drug users. Ofcoarce if you were able to buy pills over the counter in your local chamist or soemthign then this wouldnt be a problem.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Intresting that if i were to 'intoxicate' myself with a pill that would be deemed illegal, are they therefore controlling us against our will ? why is it not illegal to pump ourselves full of junk food or even use a mobile phone ? another spin is that if suicide is recognised as legal then surely doing even less damage to one's self can't be considered worse in the eyes of the law and in the eyes of human rights ? and before the do-gooders jump on that comment, could in the very unlikely event of dying whilst on ecstasy be deemed a form of suicide ? this is after all, comparable to the risks a boxer is fully aware of before he steps into the ring
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    In case anyone didn't know, actually being "loved up" isn't illegal. So technically you could walk up to a policeman, totally pingin' out yer nut on e, and tell them this fact and they wouldn't be able to arrest you because of this alone, although I'm sure they would have something to say about it!
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    what is this true ? please say so ! i know its o.k to say i've taken an illegal drug, but isn't it illegal to be 'under the influence' ? could they take you into custody till you've come down then release you without charge ?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Exactly. It is a victimless crime. Which is why it shouldn't be illegal.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I heard today on the radio that that the police in Greater London wants to adopt a policy on weekends that when they arrest one with a small quantity of e or coke they will treat him like having Class C drugs, hence just caution him... they will never legalise it but they can one day degrade it to class c. In the States a Uni wants to expiriment on how e can help people suffering from depression... which probably can help... thus one day, one could go to pharmacy and buy his tab... Awsome!
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    It's not a victimless crime tho
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by J:
    Fair enough, there are victims if someone dies, but if this was so important to the government they would outlaw ciggaretes and indeed alcohol. Theese both cause more deaths than anything else I can think of at the moment!

    Here Here!!

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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    There are one group of victims, the government, at least that's how they see it, cause pills make you realise how fucked up the world is, and this is i expect the biggest reason there illegal. imagine if everybody the world over simultaneous dropped, the world would wake the next day and be a very very different place, and not in the government of ant country's favour.

    drugs may be the road to nowhere, but at least there the scenic route
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Dimi:
    In the States a Uni wants to expiriment on how e can help people suffering from depression... which probably can help...

    I hate to say it, but all current evidence shows that long term use of E can cause depression. 2 of my friends who have been taking it for just over a year now, at a steady (and high) rate, are starting to feel very depressed during the week, to the point where one of them is taking a break from them, and one has quit altogether.

    But in the plus side, its made me a much happier person (I suffered from depression when I started taking them) and, I think, a much better person in general.

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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    i'm not arguing with that because from what i have read they are suppoosed to cause depression long term, however i have a theory that any given person can suffer from depression whether they use e or not, so it would be fair to assume depression can affect a random person at any given point in there life. So if person (a) which uses e gets depression no doubt that is attributed to the fact they use e, whereas if person (b) gets struck down with depression, who doesn't use e then they will attempt to explain it another way. Could it not be the case that both a & b have the same underlying causes, yet e is automatically blames for the causes of sufferer a ? as i suspect the so called experts would do ?

    Another point is mixing e with anti depressants can be very dangerous to the brain, not mentally but chemically and is strongly discouraged. This i believe, as it is based on hard facts and scientific evidence, whereas the depression situation is based on half hearted theories from a bunch of scientists who are payed by the government emmmmmmmm !

    drugs may be the road to nowhere, but at least there the scenic route
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Shall i say that depression on x for me is impossible! One other thing... i have stopped having the day after boredom/depression (or call it as u like) as well! Do u do anything to protect urselves? (u probably know <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/cool.gif"&gt; ) Did u know that before going to bed, the best thing to take is vitamins? the best breakfast after a mad night on e is a hot cup of ovaltine and marmite... (although i would prefer to die rather than eat marmite!) there simple things to do to avoid any 'day after effect'...
    Another thing i m not of the kind of people that take e every single day... e is a special drug... it is magic... couple of times a month r enough, just not to spoil the magic.
    2 years ago i was afraid about e and very negative to it... all it took was an amazing bird and a club... i had my first... then i had to apologise to anybody i argued against it.
    I do not promote it, i love it. I was depressed for a period but when ever i was taking some tabs i was back to normal. Nowadays that i m having probably the best time of me life <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/biggrin.gif">, when i take e i m simply having more fun... I hope what i wrote make sence as i think i got carried away...
    take care
    Dance and party as much as u can!
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    well said, a jolly good piece if i may say so ! i haven't had any depression, but never say never ! welcome to the site by the way, are you here to stay ?

    drugs may be the road to nowhere, but at least there the scenic route
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Cheers buddy. Aha. Thesite is rather good. nottingham mate... renaisance... amazing place i heard, isn't it?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I don't think E should be legal but I do believe it should be decriminalised and manufactured by reasonable govened people.

    Big problem is always whats in the pill, its far more damaging to people when your getting a pill which isn't 100% MDMA and instead a mixture of 2CB, K, MDA, MDEA, MDMA, Speed, filler agent and god knows whatelse...

    I hate the idea that as a working citizen who pays taxes and has had no previous convictions, taking a drug could have me deemed as a criminal and possibly removed from society.

    I'm not violent, I don't cause trouble when I'm out and yet I'm aparently a danger to myself and everyone around me... go figure!
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I agree with JC there.... at the moment there are about 5/6 deaths a year from taking E. If it was decriminalised, and manufactured in a controlled legal way by licenced outlets, the death rate should only go down.

    One point of interest though... I heard that someone who deals with drug related deaths said that he had every kind of pill which people had taken when they died tested, and not one of them contained anything that could have caused the death.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Dimi:
    Cheers buddy. Aha. Thesite is rather good. nottingham mate... renaisance... amazing place i heard, isn't it?

    yep ! nottingham is good in genenral, a better club night is hotdog@lost weekend, very small and intimate, mad cave kind of setting, excellent banging tunes and chill out areas and no piss heads or mean door men to give paranoia ! fairly regular crowd so its all very welcome to our happy family sort of thing ! a nice change from the superclub type setting !



    drugs may be the road to nowhere, but at least there the scenic route
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by J:
    Why not? Please explain why it's not a victimless crime?

    Suicide is a crime! but what i mean is around 70-80% of crime is drug related, which drugs etc... i will not debate, and besides it hurts friends and family, while not a legal obligation i see it as a moral one. Look mate just make sure you don't get caught ok? There are many arguements for and against good ones eitherside, i'll accept the legalisation of weed but no further cause who knows how far it'll go.
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    Girl-From-MarsGirl-From-Mars Posts: 2,822 Boards Guru
    Originally posted by Justin Credible:
    I hate the idea that as a working citizen who pays taxes and has had no previous convictions, taking a drug could have me deemed as a criminal and possibly removed from society.

    I'm not violent, I don't cause trouble when I'm out and yet I'm aparently a danger to myself and everyone around me... go figure!

    yeah this is a very good point. i dont take drugs, never have done... im not about to be dragged into a full on debate about legalisation either <IMG alt="image" SRC="http://www.thesite.org/ubb/wink.gif"&gt; but i do agree with what justin's said, i dont see why a person who uses a drug should be deemed a criminal if they arent hurting anyone but themselves (in terms of long term health issues). from what i've learned on this site, cigarettes and alcohol are far worse than E (i do drink when i go out).

    okay, the thing about E and depression... serotonin is a neurotransmitter, and the levels are much lower in depressed people *[see below]. anti-depressants (SSRIs - selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors - these are the most commonly prescribed type) increase the levels of serotonin in the brain, by preventing the chemical from being re-absorbed. the rush you get on ecstasy, and the loved up, relaxed feelings are due to the brain's store of serotonin being released rapidly. because of this action, some people think that ecstasy will damage serotonin receptors in the long term. this will result in low levels of the chemical, coming back to how depression is caused.

    * a note though: it hasnt been proved whether depression is caused by low levels of serotonin, or whether the levels are low because the person is depressed.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    5-HTP is the bodies source for creating serotonin (note what GFM said, well done) and in order for it to affectivly work in pill usage you should take it on about a 4 day period up to and after taking ecstasy.

    One mention about the neurotransmitters and ecstasy is that it does restructure their genetic design and this is what scientists argue could lead to depression in later life, however there has been no concrete evidence to prove either one right yet.

    Another thing about serotonin is that when you take tablets to overall (to a maximum effect) reduce your brains storage of serotonin to about 40% and this takes up to 2 weeks to fully resolve back to its previous effect.

    Thats why I sometimes wonder why people take batches of pills day afer day on a weekend, ecstasy releases all the brains reserves of serotonin at once (hense the loved up feelings.. blah) but once the supplies have gone they are GONE for about 2 weeks (as mentioned above) so your NOT going to get the same loved up feeling as before and all you feel is the amphetamine chemical (and byproducts) of methadiomethaphetamine (MDMA) or one of its family members.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I've posted this site before, nobody seemed to reply, but it shows in a series of diagrams exactly what happens on e and then the come-down, midweek blues and so on. Very intresting, easy to understand and it makes your awarness of whats happening alot higher ! it also explains all the seretonin stuff and anti-depressents
    http://www.dancesafe.org/slideshow




    drugs may be the road to nowhere, but at least there the scenic route
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