What you didn't read in the front pages: Spain votes Yes to the EU Constitution

Former Member

If thats the ebst you can hope for on any sort of turnout, then the whole project deserves to fail because of the massive lack of support amongst those who actually matter in a democratic society - THE PEOPLE.

Former Member

The Matadore wrote:

then the whole project deserves to fail because of the massive lack of support amongst those who actually matter in a democratic society - THE PEOPLE.

Great!!! matadore has turned a new leaf, by saying that, i suppose you must also agree that project Operation Iraqi Freedom should fail because of it's lack of support amongst those who actually matter in a democratic society- THE PEOPLE.

Former Member

Iraq had just had its first elections for 60 years, I would call that the will of THE PEOPLE.

And given the choice, I'm willing to bet the majority of Iraqis, ahd they been asked, would have backed the war before it started.

Former Member

The Matadore wrote:

Iraq had just had its first elections for 60 years, I would call that the will of THE PEOPLE.

And given the choice, I'm willing to bet the majority of Iraqis, ahd they been asked, would have backed the war before it started.

i'm not talking about Iraq, i'm talking about the millions of people who marched on the streets of london, sydney, washington, new york, rome, i'm talking about the worldwide public outrage at the reasons for going to war, thats what i'm talking about.

Former Member

Good fucking point. Besides, it was just the usual left wing loonies and some muslims who marched anyway.

I find that hilarious, those anti american zealots on the left are creating an alliance with fanatical muslims nutters against the USA, thinking that they can be 'enlightened' by socialist values!

Former Member

lukesh wrote:

A million in the UK marched.... hardly everyone is it?

Average turnout for a march? 10,000? 100,000 for the really big ones. Do you have any idea how many people 1,000,000 is, how much impact that many people have? Clearly not.

Former Member

The Matadore wrote:

If thats the ebst you can hope for on any sort of turnout, then the whole project deserves to fail because of the massive lack of support amongst those who actually matter in a democratic society - THE PEOPLE.

I wonder if you would be saying the same thing if Britain votes No but the turnout happens to be 45%. :rolleyes:

Former Member

lukesh wrote:

Wow.... isn't it just amazing? Nearly 80% of the Spanish electorate voted yes to the European Constitution.
Some of you are a complete joke.

Hereare some FACTS........
ONLY 45% of the elecorate bothered to vote. This shows that this is not an indication of the majority of the Spanish.

Could this be the same Luke who constantly goes on about Teletex polls in which only a couple thousand of sad souls take part, and pretends that those two thousand people represent the population of Britain?

Nice consistency mate

A massive 90% havn't read the Constitution. This means that the Spanish don't know what they have let them selves in for.

I reckon that's still far more people than those who have read the Constitution in Britain... most of which are simply saying NO! without even fucking knowing what the Constitution is about, letting their europhobia speak on their behalf.

It cuts both ways Luke.

So the referendum was far, far from a victory.

LOL. I like your way of thinking and window-dressing bad news Luke. Very positive attitude.

May I add about the British tabolid press not reporting on the issue. Firstly, they are tabloids remember Aladdin. These sort of papers are not for people who want to read politics are they?

Wrong. They will report politics and Constitutional matters at full length if the news suits their agenda. When the news don't suit their agenda, they'll simply pretend it didn't happen.

Nice consistency and journalistic values there!

Former Member

Lukesh and Matadore:

Who is to say that the 56% of the population who didnt vote are opposed to it?
Maybe they supported and knew it was going to go through so didnt vote.
Or perhaps they just didn't care either way.

You can't say just because of a low turnout the vote isn't acceptable. The turnout was higher than the European elections in the UK, does that mean the results are not valid and we should not accept our countries representation in the European Parliament? No, no it does not.

Former Member

noone would be able to make sense of the constitution whatsoever - i cant name any constitution for a group/company/government that does make sense, not even the rocksoc at uni has a understandable one

Former Member

Well said Renzo.

I look forward to Luke denouncing the UKIP's success in the European elections as pointless and meaningless. At the end of the day not many people at all bothered to vote...

Former Member

i feel like i live in a country of twits.

Former Member

twisted_trinity wrote:

i feel like i live in a country of twits.

theres no smoke without a fire

Former Member

On the subject of reading/understanding laws, i personally have never and probably will never read in full the actual wording of a law introduced in the UK, does that mean that my vote is completely uninformed and worthless?

Lukesh I am guessing that you have not read the Treasury reports on the Euro, I take it you will not vote in that referendum then?

Former Member

As I said on February 8th, "The right to vote is as important as the right not to vote, and sometimes has to be exercised." I was applying it in the context of a General Election at the time, but I think it can be applied on a wider basis.

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Original Comment

Former Member

Aladdin wrote:

All the major newspapers were in favour. As for the political parties, Izquierda Unida (used to be the Communist Party of Spain- sort of anyway) and some of the separatist Catalan and Basque parties were against I believe.

Doesn't that worry you though?

What kind of balanced debate does that ensure?

Much as the media over here only present one picture, and it's wrong, does the same apply for Spain?

Former Member

Possibly. Spanish media has always been a funny bunch though. In any case it hasn't got even 10% of the influence media has in this country.

Former Member

Maybe not in so few hands, but you cannot deny that they have influence.

Former Member

Man Of Kent wrote:

Given the polls which had taken place previously, I would suspect that many didn't bother to vote because they felt it was a "no-brainer".

I read a quote from one Spaniard who said that many people wouldn't vote because they hadn't read their own constitution and couldn't make an informed decision which I thought was interesting.

Former Member

lukesh wrote:

If Britian votes the UKIP then of course I'll congratulate it as thats what the British people want. However I don't wish for the UK to pull out of the E.U but not to join the Constitution as its all about copying the US and destroying NATO with a common policy for Defense.

I think you mean defenCe.

Former Member

lukesh wrote:

More accurate indication than you're opinion may I say..

LOL. Fat chance Luke...

You only ever critisise the British not knowing anything about the constitution, you never say anything about the Spanish not knowing a thing about it. Why?
Because they have voted in your favour.

When have I done that?

Whats to celebrate? Less than alf voting on something they know nothing about? I would of respected it more if it had a 60% turnout.

As I said earlier, the European elections had a turnout well below 60%. However your heroes at the time the UKIP did well and you very much respected and lauded their 'success'.

Your hypocrisy knows no limits.

If tabloid readers would like to read about how wonderful the result was in Spain then they would read the Guardian.

What the fuck are you talking about?

Are you saying that tabloid readers have no mind and the tabloids must form an opinion for them and 'protect' them from news they don't want to hear?

I'd always suspected so... Thanks for confirming it.

Former Member

lukesh wrote:

Who said it wasn't accepted?
What I said was that the vote wasn't aclear indication of Spanish opinion. It probably was but there wasn't proof to apoint that as less than half voted.

Bull-fucking-shit.

A referendum is the best indication of a country's opinion. Many millions expressed their opinion, as opposed to the 2,000 teletext polls you love so much and claim to show the will of the British public.

Are you on ket?

Former Member

The vote is a perfect indication of Spainish opinion.

More voted for than against, whilst the rest offered no opinion either way.

What more do you want Luke?

Former Member

My only question amidst all this is how you'll all react when Britain votes in September 2154 or whenever the referendum comes along.

Former Member

lukesh wrote:

When it comes down to a constitution I expect them to be higher than 40% mate. No one really cares about the European elections. Constitutional change is vital to be voted on, with a high majority.

You might not care about the European elections. A lot of people do. It is amazing that some people will not care who is representing Britain's interests in Europe...

It is as important as anything else.

Thats what tabloids are all about, accept it!

That's what I've been saying Luke- that tabloids are worthless rags masquerading as newspapers that cannot be trusted to tell a single truth other than the date and the price.

Former Member

lukesh wrote:

Less than half of the population voted. I critisise that.

Not ideal. But it doesn't make it any less valid. And it is a perfect indication of what the Spanish think and want.

Former Member

WTF? Why did you say that? Any semi-literate fool can see that the spanish voted for it.

Former Member

You said

Ok the spanish voted for the constitution

Well no shit sherlock.

Former Member

You post whore, what was the point in stating the bloody obvious?

Former Member

:rolleyes: right... because you're pointless comment helped that as well.