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racist!

24

Comments

  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by VinylVicky
    I am far from racist, im truthful and I say my opinions, my last boyfriend who I lived with for over 2 years isnt white, which makes me think your assuming things as you cant just realise people have different opinions to you. My intentions are never to offend, im sorry if you get offended easily. I dont think im immature, there are many things in my life that cannot call me for being immature, im far from it.
    Ignorance is far from it, my opinions have not been formed on their own, they are a mixture of lots of other people and they have been formed over the time of meeting many different people. I fail to see how you can assume so much about me without even knowing me. Accusing someone of being racist could be very offensive to some people, its a good job im tolerant, as I could have been quite upset by that.


    Ahhhh...the classic "I'm not racist, but..." defence, coupled with the "my ex-girl/boyfriend wasn't white" gambit.

    Seen it all before, Vicky. Go tell it to someone else.
    If you post that you think the races aren't supposed to mix and that mixed race people have personality problems, don't be surprised if you people think you are racist. Those views are straight out of the BNP handbook.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Blagsta
    Ahhhh...the classic "I'm not racist, but..." defence, coupled with the "my ex-girl/boyfriend wasn't white" gambit.

    Seen it all before, Vicky. Go tell it to someone else.
    If you post that you think the races aren't supposed to mix and that mixed race people have personality problems, don't be surprised if you people think you are racist. Those views are straight out of the BNP handbook.
    Fair play if thats how you feel, call me a racist, think what you like....and i didnt start telling you, I was replying to the thread starter. So dont bother replying to me if you dont want to listen to what I have to say.
    I had no other way of proving I not racist....so make up oyur own opinions! :lol:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by VinylVicky
    The only reason it offends me is I know there would be uproar if there was a white womens society.

    I've been through that - the whole of British society is a white woman's society.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by VinylVicky
    Fair play if thats how you feel, call me a racist, think what you like....and i didnt start telling you, I was replying to the thread starter. So dont bother replying to me if you dont want to listen to what I have to say.
    I had no other way of proving I not racist....so make up oyur own opinions! :lol:

    if you post your opinions on a public bulletin board, don't be surprised when people reply to you. :rolleyes:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Blagsta
    I've been through that - the whole of British society is a white woman's society.

    blah blah blah
    I told you ive never seen a womens society in a black/asian/other race country
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Blagsta
    if you post your opinions on a public bulletin board, don't be surprised when people reply to you. :rolleyes:

    Im not suprised I sai this as you told me to tell someone else, I was pointing out I was directed it at you!
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Vicky never said mixed race people have personality problems, from what I read she was saying how they'd have problems fitting into either of their racial groups because they aren't wholly black/white/Asian/whatever.

    Also I kind of understand what she was saying about mixing, I don't think it was a racist comment at all. If you look at British society we all live side by side but how often do different racial groups mix? How often do you see groups of people of different races hanging out together? Even in multicultural North London I see lots of different races but it's very rare to see those different races associating with each other. So what I think she was saying is although we are muticultural, we aren't integrated that well and I think she was also developing that point to say having black/Asian's womens centres doesn't help integration. We live side by side but rarely together is what I think she was saying.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by VinylVicky
    blah blah blah
    I told you ive never seen a womens society in a black/asian/other race country

    Which countries have you had experience in? I cant think of many countries that have a similar demographic to our own, but in reverse...Close to 10% whites and 90% black/asian.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by kevlar85
    Vicky never said mixed race people have personality problems, from what I read she was saying how they'd have problems fitting into either of their racial groups because they aren't wholly black/white/Asian/whatever.

    Also I kind of understand what she was saying about mixing, I don't think it was a racist comment at all. If you look at British society we all live side by side but how often do different racial groups mix? How often do you see groups of people of different races hanging out together? Even in multicultural North London I see lots of different races but it's very rare to see those different races associating with each other. So what I think she was saying is although we are muticultural, we aren't integrated that well and I think she was also developing that point to say having black/Asian's womens centres doesn't help integration. We live side by side but rarely together is what I think she was saying.

    Thankyou ;)

    Also before we had intelligence and emotions we never had the knowledge to travel or build means to travel. The theory is, we only got theses 'tools' when we developed phitzophrenia (sp completely wrong) we then went onto develop intelligence. I dont think this was meant to happen.
    Im truely not racist! I have no problem with a person because of the colour of their skin.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Balddog
    Which countries have you had experience in? I cant think of many countries that have a similar demographic to our own, but in reverse...Close to 10% whites and 90% black/asian.
    Well countries where the majority is not white, ive travelled North Africa and visited places in South Africa.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by kevlar85
    Vicky never said mixed race people have personality problems, from what I read she was saying how they'd have problems fitting into either of their racial groups because they aren't wholly black/white/Asian/whatever.

    Also I kind of understand what she was saying about mixing, I don't think it was a racist comment at all. If you look at British society we all live side by side but how often do different racial groups mix? How often do you see groups of people of different races hanging out together? Even in multicultural North London I see lots of different races but it's very rare to see those different races associating with each other. So what I think she was saying is although we are muticultural, we aren't integrated that well and I think she was also developing that point to say having black/Asian's womens centres doesn't help integration. We live side by side but rarely together is what I think she was saying.
    I did say they have personality problems, well mixed race people, not all, but this is coming from the horses mouth and not founded on just my own opinions. Ive got a care worker friend too who agrees on this she has studied it some what in psycology. As someone said earlier it could well be to do with the way people treat other races.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by VinylVicky
    I did say they have personality problems, well mixed race people, not all, but this is coming from the horses mouth and not founded on just my own opinions. Ive got a care worker friend too who agrees on this she has studied it some what in psycology. As someone said earlier it could well be to do with the way people treat other races.

    No but you're not saying that because they're mixed race they automatically have some sort of defect are you? You're saying they have identity problems which then affects their personality which is a different thing and is what I was saying. Correct me if I'm wrong but that's how I understand it.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by kevlar85
    No but you're not saying that because they're mixed race they automatically have some sort of defect are you? You're saying they have identity problems which then affects their personality which is a different thing and is what I was saying. Correct me if I'm wrong but that's how I understand it.
    Oh yeah sure, but I added it in case someone quoted me where I said it :D
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by VinylVicky
    Well countries where the majority is not white, ive travelled North Africa and visited places in South Africa.

    Not relevant. Our society is completely different. We invited lots of Afro-Carribean people over to Britain in the 50's (read up on the Windrush) with the promise of work and a better life. When they got here they were treated like shit. Having said that, Britain is very well racially integrated compared to a lot of other countries.
    But that fact is that society here is white society. If black or asian people want to have their own support groups arounf their specific cultural issues, then let them. Why does it bother you so much? You can't deny that the black British experience is very different to the white experience.

    But anyway, most countries you go to will have British enclaves. Look at the ex-pats in Spain, the British enclaves in Saudi Arabia etc.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by kevlar85
    No but you're not saying that because they're mixed race they automatically have some sort of defect are you? You're saying they have identity problems which then affects their personality which is a different thing and is what I was saying. Correct me if I'm wrong but that's how I understand it.

    This is not what she said. Its what I assumed she may have said however. And I'm sure some mixed race people do have identity problems, but this is not really helped by attitudes like Vicky's, saying that "races aren't supposed to mix". :rolleyes: Is it anywonder mixed race folk have problems with people spouting crap like that?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Blagsta
    You have to look at the history. The police did abuse the sus laws back in the 70's and 80's, they did pick on black people unfairly. This led to the Brixton, Handsworth, St Pauls etc uprisings. Read some history and look at a copy of the Scarman Report. Things are getting better, but its still not great. Black people are still more likely to be stopped if driving a nice car than white people. This leads to resentment.

    Hmm, and maybe its that statistically a black man is more likely to have nicked the nice car than a black woman or even a white woman? And do you say that a guy in a white Kappa tracksuit driving a shiny Merc is more likely to be stopped than a guy in a suit? The police are there to arrest CRIMINALS regardless of colour- the situation ahs got so ridiculous in Bradford, for instance, that now the Asians can fire rockets at the main police station and NOT ONE of them is arrested. And then if one is arrested its "called a matrix of fear", and they get a lenient sentence for rioting (including burning down a Labour Club with 100+ people in it) cut even further.

    The police are not racist, and Im sick of morons like McPherson and racist vermin like Lawrence saying they are.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Blagsta
    Ahhhh...the classic "I'm not racist, but..." defence, coupled with the "my ex-girl/boyfriend wasn't white" gambit.

    Seen it all before, Vicky. Go tell it to someone else.
    If you post that you think the races aren't supposed to mix and that mixed race people have personality problems, don't be surprised if you people think you are racist. Those views are straight out of the BNP handbook.

    And back to the point we go...

    Many black and asian people feel the same way, Nation of Islam anyone? Or are they OK because theyre not white thugs?

    And anyway in my experinece "personality problem" is an unfortunate phrase but the sentiment is accurate. Mixed-race people generally do not fit snugly into one culture or another. They are not fully British in culture, because their parents are not British, yet they are not their parents' culture because their schools are not. THAT is what has caused the disturbances in Brixton and Toxteth in the 1980s, and then the disgusting violence in Oldham and Bradford recently. Even second-generation Pakistanis and blacks that I know agree with this.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by VinylVicky
    Also before we had intelligence and emotions we never had the knowledge to travel or build means to travel. The theory is, we only got theses 'tools' when we developed phitzophrenia (sp completely wrong) we then went onto develop intelligence. I dont think this was meant to happen.

    You seem to be very ignorant and/or confused about the history of mankind. I suggest you join a local library and read some books.
    Originally posted by VinylVicky
    Im truely not racist! I have no problem with a person because of the colour of their skin.

    You have a problem with what you perceive to be preferential treatment of black and asian people. While maybe not racist (although maybe you should look at some of your attitudes) is certainly ignorant and unthinking.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Blagsta
    this is not really helped by attitudes like Vicky's, saying that "races aren't supposed to mix". :rolleyes: Is it anywonder mixed race folk have problems with people spouting crap like that?

    Why is it crap? Surely it can be argued that you wouldnt breed a poodle with a doberman, why are people all that different?

    Just curious...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Blagsta
    You have a problem with what you perceive to be preferential treatment of black and asian people. While maybe not racist (although maybe you should look at some of your attitudes) is certainly ignorant and unthinking.

    Why is it ignorant and unthinking? Blacks and Asians have plenty of problems with "preferential treatment" of whites, why cant whites argue the same thing? Is it cos the aristocracy 500 years ago sold the Africans into slavery?

    Hate to break thsi to you, but *I* didnt sell any slaves so I sure as hell arent gonna feel guilty about it.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Kermit
    And back to the point we go...

    Many black and asian people feel the same way, Nation of Islam anyone? Or are they OK because theyre not white thugs?

    Errrmmm....yes. I agree that a minority of black and asian people also agree with racial separation. But if you can find where I said this was OK, you can have my next pay cheque.

    There is a point of view though, that says racism has a power component to it, and therefore in a white society, racism from white people has more of an impact that the reverse.
    I'm not sure if I agree totally with this, but its worthy of discussion. Racism does not exist apart from the society it is found in, it is part and parcel of society and the power structures and institutions in that society.
    Originally posted by Kermit
    And anyway in my experinece "personality problem" is an unfortunate phrase but the sentiment is accurate. Mixed-race people generally do not fit snugly into one culture or another. They are not fully British in culture, because their parents are not British, yet they are not their parents' culture because their schools are not. THAT is what has caused the disturbances in Brixton and Toxteth in the 1980s, and then the disgusting violence in Oldham and Bradford recently. Even second-generation Pakistanis and blacks that I know agree with this.

    If (as I said above) Vicky had actually said this, I might not have been so harsh on her. But she didn't. She said "now everyone dont go all mad at me but most mixed race people have far more personality problems, well the ones I have met anyway."
    Now if she'd qualified that with some comment about how it might be societies attitudes to mixed race people and that these issues need to be addressed, I'd have had no problem. Instead she rambled on about races not supposing to mix. Thats a tad racist IMO.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Kermit
    Why is it crap? Surely it can be argued that you wouldnt breed a poodle with a doberman, why are people all that different?

    Just curious...

    Because people aren't dogs. :rolleyes: Do you really need that explaining to you?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Kermit
    Why is it ignorant and unthinking? Blacks and Asians have plenty of problems with "preferential treatment" of whites, why cant whites argue the same thing? Is it cos the aristocracy 500 years ago sold the Africans into slavery?

    Hate to break thsi to you, but *I* didnt sell any slaves so I sure as hell arent gonna feel guilty about it.

    History has something to do with it, yes.

    But more to the point - why shouldn't people who have cultural issues in common not be allowed to offer each other mutual support? For the record, I disagree with schools etc being segregated on the basis of religion/culture etc (but I don't see anyone arguing that C of E or Catholic schools aren't fair), but on social issues, mutual aid and support groups are fair enough.

    I ask again - why are people so bothered by it? :confused:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Blagsta
    I ask again - why are people so bothered by it? :confused:

    Because there have been many occasions where white men-only clubs have been closed as racist and mysognistic, yet other groups excluding all other (non-white) races are allowed to continue.

    Because companies effectively have to recruit "quotas" of ethnic minorities, regardless of talent. Especially the police and otehr public bodies.

    Because "positive" doesnt mean its not discrimination. There are many council jobs in Bradford which are effectively closed off to me because I am not from an ethnic minority- this has been admitted to me by council workers.

    Because universities have to take a set amount of ethnic minorities or else they dont get funding. Regardless of ability.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Blagsta
    Because people aren't dogs. :rolleyes: Do you really need that explaining to you?

    theyre animals, were animals. theyre mammals, were mammals. whats the big difference?

    why *cant* there be different breeds of human just like there are different breeds of dog or cat or cow or rabbit or bear?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Kermit
    theyre animals, were animals. theyre mammals, were mammals. whats the big difference?

    I can't believe I'm having to explain this. Humans have self-awareness, art, culture and society. Dogs don't.

    Thats the difference.
    Originally posted by Kermit
    why *cant* there be different breeds of human just like there are different breeds of dog or cat or cow or rabbit or bear?

    There are some differences, yes. For instance, most Japanese people are lacking in an enzyme that breaks down alcohol (alcohol dehydrogenase iirc). But this doesn't translate into differing "breeds". Read up on genetics and species classifications sometime. Any research showing any big differences between races has been massively discredited many times over.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Kermit
    Because there have been many occasions where white men-only clubs have been closed as racist and mysognistic, yet other groups excluding all other (non-white) races are allowed to continue.

    Because white only clubs are racist. As I said in a previous post - to discount the power relations already inherent in our society when discussing racism is dismissing a fundamental componment of what is going on and is a very flawed analysis.
    Originally posted by Kermit
    Because companies effectively have to recruit "quotas" of ethnic minorities, regardless of talent. Especially the police and otehr public bodies.

    I think that getting quotas to reflect the ethnic makeup of the community being served by public bodies is fundamemntally a good idea. But yes, the implementation is often flawed.
    Originally posted by Kermit
    Because "positive" doesnt mean its not discrimination. There are many council jobs in Bradford which are effectively closed off to me because I am not from an ethnic minority- this has been admitted to me by council workers.

    If this is the case, then it is wrong. But I'd doubt if it is the case. I've never had any problems getting a job in the public sector.
    But you have to accept that, being white, the odds are already in our favour. The fundamental flaw in your position is that you are assuming everyone starts on a level playing field. They don't.
    Originally posted by Kermit
    Because universities have to take a set amount of ethnic minorities or else they dont get funding. Regardless of ability.

    Really? Got a source for that?

    P.S.
    I like the Nick Cave quote. :)
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Blagsta
    Because white only clubs are racist. As I said in a previous post - to discount the power relations already inherent in our society when discussing racism is dismissing a fundamental componment of what is going on and is a very flawed analysis.

    But ethnic-only clubs arent? Logic please, and no bleeding-heart-liberal gobshite about power dynamics, because they arent relevant.

    I think that getting quotas to reflect the ethnic makeup of the community being served by public bodies is fundamemntally a good idea. But yes, the implementation is often flawed.

    I think getting the best person for the job is a better idea. I personally would quite happily see all 632 MPs being Pakistani, for instance, if they did their job properly.

    If this is the case, then it is wrong. But I'd doubt if it is the case. I've never had any problems getting a job in the public sector.

    It certainly is in Bradford Council. Depends on location I suppose- my council seems to think that bending over backwards to a minority community will stop them rioting, but there you go.

    But you have to accept that, being white, the odds are already in our favour.

    Yes, and they should be, given that the latest census put us at 90% dominant. Id be worried if more blacks than whites were employed, TBH:)

    The fundamental flaw in your position is that you are assuming everyone starts on a level playing field. They don't.

    But thats not a race issue. That is a financial issue- poor white people are just as discriminated against as poor ethnic minorities. Rich ethnic minorities have just as much influence as rich white men- look at the amount of powerful Jews in Britain and America, for instance. The only real problem is when the BNP tells the poor white people that its all the blacks' fault that theyve bot no money.

    Really? Got a source for that?

    The Minsiter for Education will, I believe, suffice:)

    P.S.
    I like the Nick Cave quote. :)

    As you bloody well should:p
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Kermit
    But ethnic-only clubs arent? Logic please, and no bleeding-heart-liberal gobshite about power dynamics, because they arent relevant.

    So you're denying that racism exists within a social context? Errrr....OK :confused: I ain't got much more to say to you then.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    kermit,

    Why wont a poodle and doberman breed? You highlighted the problem with this in your question...We wouldnt breed a doberman and a poodle, people dont get bred by their owners. We choose our partners, dogs are in captivity and as such have their mates chosen for them...If dogs were wild, in their current state, its perfectly possible that a doberman would mate with a poodle..

    Its hardly a valid comparison...There are different breeds of people, but interbreeding goes on in the dog world, just as it does in the human world...The only people that have a problem with either are those who want to maintain the purity of a particular breed. Doberman breeders and poodle breeders want thoroughbreds.
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