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How did you vote?

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Comments

  • GreenTeaGreenTea ☕🌻☕ MidlandsPosts: 9,032 Supreme Poster
    The funding cuts aren't steady... If they were the schools in the most deprived areas wouldn't be the ones facing the biggest cuts? How is that fair? Plenty of better off schools with cuts not as big or even an increase?
    Explain to me how that's ok?

    The scars you can't see are the hardest to heal.     

    Astrid Alauda

  • AidanAidan Clever idiot Posts: 2,629 Boards Champion
    edited December 2019
    I meant cuts across areas of spending i.e health, education, welfare etc. 

    It completely overlooks the (still very important) human and personal side of it- but it makes financial sense to cut poorer areas more than richer ones because the extra investment in the richer ones returns more money later on (through people being on higher incomes and so paying more tax, basically). 

    It sucks that deprived areas are suffering more under austerity than those financially better off, but nobody can say they've voted for a party without any bad ideas or incompetency.
    "Do, or do not, there is no try" <(•.•)>              
  • GreenTeaGreenTea ☕🌻☕ MidlandsPosts: 9,032 Supreme Poster
    Boris Johnson doesn't care about those in poverty and worse off areas

    The scars you can't see are the hardest to heal.     

    Astrid Alauda

    Laine
  • GreenTeaGreenTea ☕🌻☕ MidlandsPosts: 9,032 Supreme Poster
    It's not fair that the poor need to be poorer. I cant afford heating and have to sleep in hoodies because it's cold and I know other people do to and I work 2 jobs in sectors that keep being cut. Id hate to think how people worse off than me have to suffer

    The scars you can't see are the hardest to heal.     

    Astrid Alauda

    AidanJellyelephantLaine
  • AidanAidan Clever idiot Posts: 2,629 Boards Champion
    edited December 2019
    Whether he cares or not, he can't spend money the nation doesn't have on the poorer areas or it will make things worse in the long run. Debt left unpaid gets higher. And being financially harder on the rich- people who are privileged to afford to move themselves and any of their businesses out of the UK to avoid financial difficulty- increases the load on the poor in the long run too.
    "Do, or do not, there is no try" <(•.•)>              
  • GreenTeaGreenTea ☕🌻☕ MidlandsPosts: 9,032 Supreme Poster
    Debt won't change because more people are gonna be unwell and need the NHS Because their homes are too cold and they can't eat. Putting more pressure on the NHS.
    Boris doesn't care about the debt. He really doesn't. He wants to make the rich better off and doesn't give a shit about others. 

    The scars you can't see are the hardest to heal.     

    Astrid Alauda

    Laine
  • AidanAidan Clever idiot Posts: 2,629 Boards Champion
    It isn't fair at all, but it needs to happen now or in an even larger magnitude later. And that's worse.
    "Do, or do not, there is no try" <(•.•)>              
  • GreenTeaGreenTea ☕🌻☕ MidlandsPosts: 9,032 Supreme Poster
    Let's see how many more families end up homeless in the next 5 years. 
    Foodbanks are already on the rise again. 

    The scars you can't see are the hardest to heal.     

    Astrid Alauda

    Laine
  • AidanAidan Clever idiot Posts: 2,629 Boards Champion
    GreenTea said:
    Debt won't change because more people are gonna be unwell and need the NHS Because their homes are too cold and they can't eat. Putting more pressure on the NHS.
    Boris doesn't care about the debt. He really doesn't. He wants to make the rich better off and doesn't give a shit about others. 

    Making the rich better off isn't in his interest because then where do the votes come from? The majority of voters aren't the rich. The about 14,000,000 people who thought the Conservatives were the better choice this election aren't all rich. Politicians have to pander to the needs of the many, not the few, to get votes and get in government.
    "Do, or do not, there is no try" <(•.•)>              
  • GreenTeaGreenTea ☕🌻☕ MidlandsPosts: 9,032 Supreme Poster
    Tories need to stop taking from the poor. I'm sure Boris and other politicians could do with a pay cut which can go towards other things. . That will help the country massively

    The scars you can't see are the hardest to heal.     

    Astrid Alauda

    Laine
  • AidanAidan Clever idiot Posts: 2,629 Boards Champion
    I agree with you about the state of the country and that, basically, things need funding more. I think we're basically disagreeing about how to get there. So let's agree to disagree, and hope things start to look up.
    "Do, or do not, there is no try" <(•.•)>              
  • GreenTeaGreenTea ☕🌻☕ MidlandsPosts: 9,032 Supreme Poster
    The Tories fucked up the country in the first place and will keep doing it

    The scars you can't see are the hardest to heal.     

    Astrid Alauda

    Laine
  • JellyelephantJellyelephant Bpd bitch ✌🏼 Posts: 792 Part of The Mix Family
    Let’s face it - the government can magically find money for things when it suits them. Like when Theresa may wanted to DUP to help her make a government and oh look we have £1bn to bribe them with 
    The sun will rise and we will try again 
    LaineAidan
  • ShaunieShaunie I’m alive but I’m dead England 🏠Posts: 11,260 An Original Mixlorian
    edited December 2019
    Deleted incase was offensive 
    just was memes
    𝐘𝐨𝐮 𝐡𝐚𝐯𝐞 𝐭𝐨 𝐬𝐭𝐨𝐩 𝐝𝐨𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐠𝐬 𝐭𝐨 𝐦𝐚𝐤𝐞 𝐨𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐫 𝐩𝐞𝐨𝐩𝐥𝐞 𝐥𝐢𝐤𝐞 𝐲𝐨𝐮, 𝐚𝐬 𝐲𝐨𝐮 𝐠𝐨 𝐭𝐡𝐫𝐨𝐮𝐠𝐡 𝐥𝐢𝐟𝐞 𝐲𝐨𝐮 𝐰𝐢𝐥𝐥 𝐞𝐧𝐜𝐨𝐮𝐧𝐭𝐞𝐫 𝐩𝐞𝐨𝐩𝐥𝐞 𝐰𝐡𝐨 𝐝𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐥𝐢𝐤𝐞 𝐲𝐨𝐮. 𝐁𝐮𝐭 𝐲𝐨𝐮 𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐬𝐭𝐢𝐥𝐥 𝐥𝐢𝐤𝐞𝐚𝐛𝐥𝐞 𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐩𝐞𝐨𝐩𝐥𝐞 𝐰𝐡𝐨 𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐫𝐢𝐠𝐡𝐭 𝐟𝐨𝐫 𝐲𝐨𝐮. 𝐒𝐨 𝐛𝐞 𝐮𝐧𝐚𝐩𝐨𝐥𝐨𝐠𝐞𝐭𝐢𝐜𝐚𝐥𝐥𝐲 𝐲𝐨𝐮𝐫𝐬𝐞𝐥𝐟 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐫𝐢𝐠𝐡𝐭 𝐩𝐞𝐨𝐩𝐥𝐞 𝐰𝐢𝐥𝐥 𝐬𝐭𝐢𝐜𝐤 𝐚𝐫𝐨𝐮𝐧𝐝. 💕💕
  • AidanAidan Clever idiot Posts: 2,629 Boards Champion
    Lol they're funny though, love memes

     
    "Do, or do not, there is no try" <(•.•)>              
  • SkiveSkive No discipline. No morality. No respect. New ForestPosts: 15,155 Skive's The Limit
    Aidan said:
    I voted Conservative :smiley:

    I know there's a lot of pressure for young people to vote Labour (or Lib Dem, or anyone besides the Conservatives really) because it's expected in a way; the left-wing ideals appeal to most young people who tend to be more progressive and open-minded than older generations (but also lack the political insight of older generations who have been through more elections and governments). There can be a lot of flak and abuse you can get from non-Conservative voters, although I suppose it can easily work both ways too.

    Everyone is entitled to their opinions, and you can still respect other views whilst also personally disagreeing :)


    The way I see it:

    • A Conservative government is like christmas on the cheap. You still have christmas, but it isn't as good as you wish it could be. You're saving money now so you can pay off debts and have more to spend down the line- but it means things get worse before they get better.

    • A Labour government is like christmas on a credit card. You have a great christmas now by spending money you don't have, but later down the line you're only gonna have the money for a christmas on the cheap.

    Besides, I've not liked Labour's direction since the end of New Labour, I think it's swayed back a bit too far to the left. I think another center-left Labour could make a resurgence again as the last election showed most people don't align with Labour's current ideals. They lost a lot of seats to the Conservatives even in working class constituencies (like mine) that had never had a Conservative MP in 100 years of political history.

    Nationalising business sectors is expensive, passes debt onto the tax payer, stifles business with red tape, and reduces competition in terms of pricing and innovation. Nothing in the Conservative manifesto made me vote for them. It was Labour's manifesto that made me vote Conservative- I was still undecided til that point.

    I'm not for privatising the NHS btw. It's important that emergency care is available to everyone regardless of wealth. I just don't believe that the NHS is 'up for sale' to Donald Trump (who btw might not be US president for much longer anyway), and even if it is, a large proportion of the NHS is private now anyway. GPs are private, and sub-contracting and privatisation has already been happening in the NHS under '90s-'00s New Labour and continued into the current Conservative regime. There's not a large proportion left to 'sell', and based on Labour's actions in their last majority government I wouldn't presume a Labour vote means the NHS wouldn't be privitised further anyway.

    Whichever way the vote goes, it's never the end of the world. You get to try again in 5 years max, and I can see a lot of 'borrowed' tory votes going back to Labour and the other parties which didn't support getting brexit over with to the same extent as the British public.

    Sorry for what basically amounts to a rant :lol: it's been a turbulent election lol and I hope I've offered a bit of insight to anyone who can't image why a massive majority voted Conservative!


    It's a mistake to treat austerity like a a household balance sheet.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=go2bVGi0ReE&t=167s

    Tory and Lib Dem imposed austerity have seen services cut for the most vulnerable people in society. As a result child poverty is up, food bank usage is up and many thousands of people have died as a result of cuts. 

    Austerity is morally repugnant. It essentially makes the poor pay for the mistakes of the very richest people in society. Austerity is theft - the greatest transfer of wealth from the poor to the rich since the encloisure act.

    As for people not 'aligning' with Labours current manifesto. I don't see any evidence of that. The election was lost because of 2 things. Labours terrible policy on Brexit, and Jeremy Corbyns unpopularity.

    Labours policies were actually quite popular.

    https://voteforpolicies.org.uk/survey/results/xEywErgCnyPgU3u7?fbclid=IwAR2chGXE-9Eexc7vsYaBQjZGggndoZysnh7Y0fyQXuT1NSb87gpwGkF2v4g#/country-results


    Yesterday is history
    Tomorrow is a mystery
    But today is a gift
    That’s why it’s call the present
  • AidanAidan Clever idiot Posts: 2,629 Boards Champion
    Hey everyone, thanks for your views it's been interesting hearing them :)

    Been particularly interesting to see the apparent anti-Conservative sentiment despite the largest majority they've had in decades. I suppose too that's it's because of the general Brexit and Corbyn sentiments that dominated the political landscape this election.

    Austerity remains controversial but it's at least good to see the debt stop climbing so much in recent years and the deficits in budgets reduce gradually. Naturally with the least wealthy being more reliant on public spending than the most wealthy, the public spending cuts have hit poorer areas harder and isn't a perfect system socioeconomically. This does need to change but in an economically sustainable way. Austerity isn't sustainable for a long time either, but governments do tend to shift between Labour and the Conservatives every 15-20 years or so with the odd anomaly.

    Certainly been one of the more interesting elections (as far as elections go, lol), and interested to see how the next one goes too and how the Conservatives' decisive 'borrowed' votes change around.

    Great to see people still interested in politics in spite of falling voter turnout over the last few decades! :)
    "Do, or do not, there is no try" <(•.•)>              
  • SkiveSkive No discipline. No morality. No respect. New ForestPosts: 15,155 Skive's The Limit
    edited December 2019
    Aidan said:

    Austerity remains controversial but it's at least good to see the debt stop climbing so much in recent years and the deficits in budgets reduce gradually. Naturally with the least wealthy being more reliant on public spending than the most wealthy, the public spending cuts have hit poorer areas harder and isn't a perfect system socioeconomically. This does need to change but in an economically sustainable way. Austerity isn't sustainable for a long time either, but governments do tend to shift between Labour and the Conservatives every 15-20 years or so with the odd anomaly.

    It's not that controversial. Most academics and economists including those working for the IMF agree that austerity policies don't workk, and do more harm than good. Austerity is very good for transferring debt from the rich to the poorest areas of society however.

    The financial crisis was brought on by the type of financial deregualtion the Tories are still pushing, but it wasn't the bankers and the financial elite that had to pay for their mistakes - they were bailed out by the public purse, and they were still payed millions in bonuses,

    Have a read of this.
    https://www.equalitytrust.org.uk/wealth-tracker-18

    While the rich have got richer, child poverty has increased, food bank usage has shot up and thousands of the most vulnerbale poeple in society have died - as a direct result of the policy you are supporting and defending. 

    The deficit is lower. However, debt has continued to increase from 63% of GDP in 2009/10 and is expected to be over 82% this year.

    Austerity is a economically illiterate, morally bankrupt, and a dangerous idea. 

    Yesterday is history
    Tomorrow is a mystery
    But today is a gift
    That’s why it’s call the present
    JellyelephantLaine
  • SkiveSkive No discipline. No morality. No respect. New ForestPosts: 15,155 Skive's The Limit
    A 2015 report published by Psychologists for Social Change indicated that austerity had contributed significantly to the incidence and level of depression and other mental health conditions within the population. In 2016, figures analysed by the King's Fund think tank showed that "mental health trusts in England were still having their budgets cut, despite government assurances they would be funded on a par with physical healthcare". The analysis "suggests 40% of the 58 trusts saw budgets cut in 2015–16

    Between 1998 and 2012 the number of children living in "relative poverty" in the UK had fallen by approximately 800,000 to a total of around 3.5 million. Following the introduction of the Welfare Reform Act 2012 the number of children in "relative poverty" increased, with the total by 2019 around 600,000 higher than it had been in 2012. During those seven years the number of children obtaining food from the food banks of The Trussell Trust more than tripled.

    When the coalition government came to power in 2010, capital investment in new affordable homes was cut by 60%. The rate of starting social rented schemes had declined from 40,000 in 2009/10 to less than 1,000 in 2015/16

    Research funded by the National Institute for Health Research and published in 2015 identified austerity as one of the factors responsible for a rise in suicide attempts and suicide deaths since 2008, particularly in regard to Jobcentre policies. In 2017, the Royal Society of Medicine said that government austerity decisions in health and social care were likely to have resulted in 30,000 deaths in England and Wales in 2015
    Yesterday is history
    Tomorrow is a mystery
    But today is a gift
    That’s why it’s call the present
    Laine
  • PoppyBPoppyB Posts: 228 Moderator
    It's been very interesting to read how everyone has voted so far and it's nice to see that everyone is being respectful despite having different political persuasions :) I do think that Brexit has polarised the country and we desperately need time to heal. 

    I supported Labour's policies but ultimately voted Lib Dems in this election due to their stance on Brexit (although where I live is a Conservative safe seat).

    I completely agree with the above posts that public spending needs to vastly increase - I work in local government and have witnessed firsthand how devastating the impact of austerity has been for vulnerable people. The decrease in funding from central government each years means it becomes harder to provide high quality services to meet rising demand, forcing us to increase council taxes and fees & charges.  

    @Skive your posts are very insightful and clearly well researched - when I get a chance I will read through the links you have posted :)
  • independent_independent_ Resident Coffee Addict ScotlandPosts: 5,177 Part of The Furniture
    Hey everyone,

    An interesting discussion here. I couldn’t vote as I’m only 17 but if I was voting, I would vote SNP (I even persuaded my English mother).

    Scotland should have a say in our own future. That’s why - we voted overwhelmingly against Brexit and it’s being forced on us by this scary Tory majority.

    As someone who studies politics, this view seems pretty common in my class group. There is one bloke who has similar views to @Aidan in my class though. I respect all opinions even if they aren’t my own (you have to when you’re in a politics class haha).
    “Sometimes the people around you won’t understand your journey. They don’t need to, it’s not for them.”
    AidanLaine
  • AidanAidan Clever idiot Posts: 2,629 Boards Champion
    edited December 2019
    @Skive you make a compelling and well-supported argument against austerity and having given it some research since, I have to agree that it's ineffective and creates problems. Financial experts agree that this last economic recovery has been one of the slowest too. While cutting expense and rising tax seems like it just should make more money, it reduces the GDP- so when looking at debt as a %GDP, debt changes very little. A short-term overspend can actually revitalise an economy, and more quickly than a long-term underspend. Not saying recovery isn't happening under the Conservatives, it's just been slow and problematic- though the economic results of Labour's manifesto can only be pure speculation so cannot be compared.

    I still think I'd have voted the same way. This election was the Brexit election. If nothing else changes, the next election will be the NHS or climate change election and I may well vote for Labour next time around if they continue to take climate change more seriously than the Conservatives. I am happy with the Conservatives current plans for the NHS, though I'm skeptical of the execution.

    I felt a lot of frustration with Brexit and a hung parliament being spanners in the political works, and I felt Labour didn't respect the referendum results as much as the Conservatives nor would they get a majority.

    Understand everyone else's views to an extent, and just wish parliament could be as level-headed and calm as the debate here :smile:
    "Do, or do not, there is no try" <(•.•)>              
    independent_
  • independent_independent_ Resident Coffee Addict ScotlandPosts: 5,177 Part of The Furniture
    It would be great if parliament could have debates like this ;)  they’re never calm in there. I’ve watched enough BBC Parliament (sad I know) to know that lol. This is a great discussion.
    “Sometimes the people around you won’t understand your journey. They don’t need to, it’s not for them.”
    AidanPoppyB
  • JellyelephantJellyelephant Bpd bitch ✌🏼 Posts: 792 Part of The Mix Family
    Funnily enough - some of the rich people that financially supported the conservatives pro Brexit campaign have used their wealth to buy a Cypriot passport so they can still have the benefits of the UK (such as freedom of movement). Makes me so mad because I dont Want to leave the EU and I don’t have millions of pounds to spend in Cyprus so yeh. 


    The sun will rise and we will try again 
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