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FAO Clandestine and the likes

Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
How to Write a Hate Israel Column

Twenty steps for success!

1. Use the term 'Zionist' liberally. Even if the context isn't clear.

2. The Zionist Entity is a good fall guy.

3. If you mention Ariel Sharon, ALWAYS follow it up with 'the butcher of Sabra and Chatilla.' For dramatic effect.

4. If a Jew speaks out against Israel, utilize the novelty. Thus, it is vitally important that you let the reader know they are a Jew.

5. Talk about 'Zionist opression' in order to close logic gaps. For example, if you need to reconicile how women in Saudi Arabia are beaten regularly by their husbands while in Israel that would be a crime, blame the Zionists for opressing the Arab people.

6. If an Israeli bulldozer knocks down one Palestinian home, it's worse than Auschwitz.

7. If you take information from a Hamas website, treat it as fact. If you take information from the Jerusalem Post, treat is suspiciously.

8. The Holocaust didn't happen, but Israeli Occupation is worse than it anyway.

9. If you write for Reuters, NEVER use the word 'terrorism.'

10. Remember that Rachel Corrie was killed in a tragic accident murdered by Zionist thugs. If you're writing for an American audience, remind them that she was an American. (For international audiences, don't remind them, since they hate Americans.)

11. If Ariel Sharon is found guilty of war crimes by a Belgian court, praise the decision as a defining moment for international justice (provided it doesn't happen to Arafat).

12. If Ariel Sharon is found innocent by that same court, decry the trial as a travesty of a mockery of a sham of a mockery of a travesty of two mockeries of a sham.

13. There was a massacre in Jenin. A big, huge massacre. Worse than the Holocaust. Lots of people (we don't know how many due to a Zionist coverup) died. (Note: Ignore the reports of Amnesty International, the Red Cross and HRW. While usually right, they are wrong this time.)

14. Historical context is unimportant. History begins in 1948 when evil Zionist Stormtroopers came out of the clouds and vanquished the peace-loving Palestinians from their villages.

15. Palestinians who kill woman and children not 'terrorists.' They are martyrs!

16. Israeli soliders who knock down houses to stop terrorists martyrs from shooting at them are the REAL terrorists.

17. Israeli Settlers are not people. They are a subhuman, mutated pseudohumanoid species bred in a secret laboratory by evil Zionist scientists who want to create an army of SuperJews to take over the world.

18. Every Israeli is a settler, no matter where they live.

19. Mention 'Greater Israel' a lot. It's not neccessary to be consistent about what this means, just mention it.

20. If you've got no fresh ideas, blame the Zionists.


Thought you could use a tip or two ;)
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Comments

  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I think Clandestine has been liberated. :eek:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Never had need of liberation thank you very much. Just taking a well deserved respite from such inane drivel as Jacq is wont to post.

    Jacq, nice attempt at humour save that its little more than the age old smokescreen for avoiding any accountability from the Israeli government. Of course since we all know that any critique of Israeli policy is by definition "anti-semitic" you really didnt have to go to all the trouble of copy/pasting. :rolleyes:

    Carry on...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Never had need of liberation

    blahaaaaaaaaa. Sorry, I pictured you off on the front of some US tank..saying: America berry good. :hyper:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Clandestine
    Never had need of liberation thank you very much. Just taking a well deserved respite from such inane drivel as Jacq is wont to post.

    Jacq, nice attempt at humour save that its little more than the age old smokescreen for avoiding any accountability from the Israeli government. Of course since we all know that any critique of Israeli policy is by definition "anti-semitic" you really didnt have to go to all the trouble of copy/pasting. :rolleyes:

    Carry on...

    Silly me... I never thought of the fact that it might not amuse you, as you have probably followed the recipe once or twice ;)

    Btw, care to answer the question posted in this thread ?

    Wb, btw...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Thanks but i shant be diverting much of my time to the discussions any longer. Too many meetings and proposals filling up my schedule.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    The least you can do is clarifying what you meant... I mean if you're already here.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Jacq that is BS and you know it. Not even funny BS. I could write something very similar entitled;

    How to write a column in support of US/UK/Israel Brutality.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Simbelyne
    Jacq that is BS and you know it. Not even funny BS. I could write something very similar entitled;

    How to write a column in support of US/UK/Israel Brutality.

    Humor is relative.
    I did indeed find it funny.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Clandestine
    Jacq, nice attempt at humour save that its little more than the age old smokescreen for avoiding any accountability from the Israeli government. Of course since we all know that any critique of Israeli policy is by definition "anti-semitic" you really didnt have to go to all the trouble of copy/pasting. :rolleyes:

    *searches*

    Sorry Clandestine, but it isn't here...

    *searches again*

    No, no I'm sure.

    Looks like you'll have to get yourself a new sense of humour, cos I can't find it either...

    :p
    Originally posted by Simbelyne
    Jacq that is BS and you know it. Not even funny BS. I could write something very similar entitled;

    Actually it was pretty much spot on as many of Heydrich/Clandestine's anti-jew/Israel posts show.

    Hell, I don't like what the Israeli Govt does, but even I can see the Truth those "rules"...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    In equating my comments with the outright anti semitic comments of Heydrich only undermines the credibility of your own claims in this regard.

    Once again since you obviously have as much difficulty comprehending concepts as Jacq and certain others here....

    Criticism of the Israeli government and what is commonly referred to in terms of a "zionist expansionist agenda" by international policy analysts from many well known and respected policy institutes is not "anti-semitism".

    Those who claim it is are, as stated above, merely seeking to dodge any question of accountability by hiding behind the "perpetual victim" mentality that has become the stock in trade for Israeli spin artists.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I just looked on my calendar. It's Holocaust Remembrance Day.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    You were TOLD Clandestine !



    That was a very good post Jacqueline the Ripper.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Clandestine
    In equating my comments with the outright anti semitic comments of Heydrich only undermines the credibility of your own claims in this regard.

    Actually it highlights how close you come at times.
    Criticism of the Israeli government and what is commonly referred to in terms of a "zionist expansionist agenda" by international policy analysts from many well known and respected policy institutes is not "anti-semitism".

    It depends on perspective doesn't it. If you think that every Israeli Govt since 1947 has been Zionist in its nature then I'd agree with you, but they haven't. yet the Palestinians and Arab neighbours have been attacking them, in one form or another ever since. no suprise that Israel reacts then, but rather than accept the responsibility that these nations/people have, you place the blame on the Israelis. Israeli who are, in the main, Jewish and not Zionist.
    Those who claim it is are, as stated above, merely seeking to dodge any question of accountability by hiding behind the "perpetual victim" mentality that has become the stock in trade for Israeli spin artists.

    Whilst those who accuse Israel use the perpetual agressor stance. And then blame it all on the faceless "Zionist".

    Often using that term bacause they know that if they said "Jew" they would be regarded as anti-semite. hence why a reprobate like Heydrich blames so much on "Zionists"...

    BTW Please remind me, when did the state of Israel first go to war?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Man Of Kent
    It depends on perspective doesn't it. If you think that every Israeli Govt since 1947 has been Zionist in its nature then I'd agree with you, but they haven't. yet the Palestinians and Arab neighbours have been attacking them, in one form or another ever since. no suprise that Israel reacts then, but rather than accept the responsibility that these nations/people have, you place the blame on the Israelis. Israeli who are, in the main, Jewish and not Zionist.

    The israeli govt. is blamed. Not Israeli's in general. The israeli govt. is made up largely of right wing zionists (My friend Lian who recently moved out of Israel calls them 'Fascists'). The palestinians have a responsibility once Israel gives assurances that no more incursions will be made into Palestine and vacate ALL the settlements to stop all terrorists.

    What I really want to know is why the PA and the IDF don't work together rather than the IDF knocking down a police station/govt. building whenever there is an attack. A bit counter-productive don't you think?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I've stayed away from this thread until now as I took the piece Jacqueline posted as a highly biased yet humourous (or would-be humourous) thing, just like many others everyone receives by email regularly. But since the thread has now become the usual Middle East discussion I might as well join in.

    MoK, I find it a bit outrageous that you join the names of Heydrich and Clandestine in the same sentence. The two could not be more different. I don't recall any piece by Clandestine where he makes any racist comments against the Jewish or the people of Israel as a whole. He is very vocal in his criticism of the Israeli government and army as well as some of its citizens, but sadly this appears to be all you need to do to become an anti-semite nowadays.
    Nor is the piece spot-on about anything. I wouldn't deny that many Palestinian sources employ that such tactics, but critics of Israel in Europe and America- to whom this piece is clearly directed to- don't use such language and spin. Anyone who wanted to have a go could do a point-by-point demolition of the piece, but since it is a tongue-in-cheek humourous piece there is not much point to it. However if anyone wants me to analyze the claims seriously I'll be happy to oblige. :D

    Matadore, why don't you give us your thoughts on the issues at hand? Because I can't see how Clandestine could have been "told" about anything.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Simbelyne

    What I really want to know is why the PA and the IDF don't work together... ?

    That is the question that Yassar Arafat has been unable to answer over and over and over...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Considering that:

    - The IDF has systematically destroyed most if not all of the Palestinian Authority buildings, including police stations, offices and the HQ.

    - Afarat has been constantly threatened with exile or prison, denied travel, bombed, called 'irrelevant' and compared to bin Laden :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

    - The whole of occupied Palestine has been reduced to rubble-covered shambles with no essential services and no infrastructure or capability to be 'run' in anyway

    you could be forgiven for understanding why the PA has not been working with the IDF.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    A little effort to actually learn the agreements and timelines of what has happened in the region might help, Aladdin. It is Arafat who has consistently proven to be unable to keep his word in any way, not the Israelis. The Israelis have maintained an agreement with Egypt for over 20 years. They have delivered each of the initial steps of each agreement with the Palestinian Authority...and Arafat has consistently failed to deliver the initial steps that he has promised. Obviously, Arafat is the wrong person to negotiate with.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Apart of course from:

    - failing to return the occupied territories in full and as pre-1967 borders

    - failing to put a stop and dismantle the illegal settlements

    - failing to allow the return of refugees

    - failing to fully and permanently withdraw its military from Palestinian land

    Outstanding demands which go as far back as 35 years ago.

    Arafat does not seem to be the only one who has failed to deliver does he?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Aladdin

    Outstanding demands which go as far back as 35 years ago.

    Demands don't make for very effective negotiations. Maybe you should go discuss that with the Palestinians.

    Do the words "initial steps" mean anything to you?

    Agreements require both sides to abide by them. When one side does the initial points required, and the other doesn't, it is stupid to expect the first side to continue with the rest of the agreement.

    Do you continue to work for an employer if they don't pay you?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    The Palestinians have also made concessions and taken initial steps of their own Greenhat. But what further point is there in negotiating when you get the Prime Minister of Israel saying he will never, ever agree to a Palestinian State, or dismantle the illegal settlements, or return to the pre-1967 borders, or allow the return of the refugees?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    - failing to allow the return of refugees

    Palestinians have to let that one go. It doesn't matter who is right or wrong...it won't happen because to do that would be the end of a "Jewish" state. It'll be more like South Africa was. Or they could follow Hamas and they'll never know more than what they have now. They could have a prosperous state if they do let that go. Both sides are so focused on their pasts that they trade away their future...sometimes literally with the deaths of people our age.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Aladdin
    MoK, I find it a bit outrageous that you join the names of Heydrich and Clandestine in the same sentence. The two could not be more different. I don't recall any piece by Clandestine where he makes any racist comments against the Jewish or the people of Israel as a whole.

    I didn't think that I said he had. I pointed out that both complain about Zionists - what I didn't say was that one does so because he is racist, the other because it is a convenient group to place blame on.

    A question for you, and Simbelyne really, because both of you have suggested that the Israli Govt is Zionist, but not Israelis. If the Govt is Zionist, and they are elected democratically, who elects them? Is the suggestion that the majority of the population is Zionist?

    What about the other questions I raise - about how the Israeli Govt is always portrayed as aggressive...
    Nor is the piece spot-on about anything. I wouldn't deny that many Palestinian sources employ that such tactics

    Isn't that a contradiction?

    If the "sources" use such tactis, why isn't it spot on?
    Originally posted by Simbelyne
    The palestinians have a responsibility once Israel gives assurances that no more incursions will be made into Palestine and vacate ALL the settlements to stop all terrorists.

    Events yesterday show that Israeli forces on the streets cannot stop the terrorists. The scumbag who set off yesterday's bomb came from an area where Israeli tanks currently reside.

    However, where I don't agree is where you suggest that Palestinians have a responsibility after Israeli withdrawl. This is wrong. Palestinian Authority has an obligation now to do everything they can to prevent such atrocities (and the are atrocities), but they have failed to do so. Here's hoping that the new PM makes a difference.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I believe the question of zionism is a personal one. Undoubtedly some members of the government are Zionists and some aren't. And some of the electorate are Zionists and some aren't. Hell, there are probably some Zionists who vote Labour.

    Zionism as a movement and a train of thought is still present and embedded in Israeli politics and indeed the US, but that does not necessarily mean the entire government and population of Israel are Zionists.

    As for the piece, what I meant is that it does not speak the truth about what the situation is, or what most critics of Israel say. There might indeed be some in Palestine who use such tactics, but we're talking about Westerner critics of Israeli policy. See the references to Reuters or doing research by visiting the Hamas website, or indeed the very title of the piece. I get the impression it is directed at us in the West, not to a Palestinian. I have not encountered any comments by anyone here or in the normal press about the Jews' fault that Saudis beat up their wives, etc etc.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Zionism does not equal being right of centre.
    I know many Zionists, who vote Meretz.

    Zionism is as a whole, acceptance and support of the state Israel. Within that definition, where the state of Israel is placed, and how big Israel is, isn't cleared.
    Originally posted by Aladdin

    MoK, I find it a bit outrageous that you join the names of Heydrich and Clandestine in the same sentence.

    Why? Did you notice that Clandestine never disagreed with Heydrich?
    Usually he is very profilic when he doesn't agree about something.
    In Heydrichs threads, he only managed to find flaws with pnj...
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by pnjsurferpoet
    I just looked on my calendar. It's Holocaust Remembrance Day.

    And so many people who actually survived the Holocaust, don't survive suicide bombings.
    People go through hell, only to get their life cut off by a lunatic with issues.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I thought of that too Jac.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Jacqueline the Ripper
    Zionism is as a whole, acceptance and support of the state Israel. Within that definition, where the state of Israel is placed, and how big Israel is, isn't cleared.
    It's a tad more complicated than that though. Two of the basic pillars of Zionism were to attain a Jewish majority in Palestine and to acquire statehood irrespective of the wishes of the indigenous population. Non-recognition of the political and national rights of the Palestinian people was a key Zionist policy from the beginning. And it all boils down to one principle: Zionists believe that the Jewish people have an inherent and inalienable right to Palestine.

    So by no means one needs to be Zionist to believe in the right to exist for Israel as free and independent nation. Zionism is a movement marred by its extremism and lack of tolerance towards the indigenous non-Jewish population.

    Why? Did you notice that Clandestine never disagreed with Heydrich?
    Usually he is very profilic when he doesn't agree about something.
    In Heydrichs threads, he only managed to find flaws with pnj...
    I've just seen a few of the threads Heydrich started and I must say I hadn't seen any of that. I saw the one titled The War on Iraq- Conceived in Israel and Clandestine simply pointed out the differences between Zionism and Judaism. I haven't read many of the threads though as I have been generally avoiding getting involved in Heydrich's posts for obvious reasons.

    I still think the comparison is highly unfair as one person is a racist and the other isn't. A different league altogether.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Aladdin
    It's a tad more complicated than that though. Two of the basic pillars of Zionism were to attain a Jewish majority in Palestine and to acquire statehood irrespective of the wishes of the indigenous population. Non-recognition of the political and national rights of the Palestinian people was a key Zionist policy from the beginning. And it all boils down to one principle: Zionists believe that the Jewish people have an inherent and inalienable right to Palestine.

    So by no means one needs to be Zionist to believe in the right to exist for Israel as free and independent nation. Zionism is a movement marred by its extremism and lack of tolerance towards the indigenous non-Jewish population.

    Herzl? Argentina/Uganda?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Aladdin
    See the references to Reuters or doing research by visiting the Hamas website, or indeed the very title of the piece.

    Perhaps you didn't track the link I was sent to by Clandestine a few days ago... ;)
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