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A Tartaristic approach for liberated Iraq.

Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
Tatarstan is widely seen as the leader in an emerging new liberal brand of Islamic thought - dubbed "Euro-Islam" by its supporters - that preaches democracy, tolerance and acceptance of secular social values and government.

Why not?
:cool:

Comments

  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Iraq has its traditions and customs. Presuming to impose a way of thinking born from generations of living in the west is simply unrealistic.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    clandestine,

    Democracy is a rather novel concept. What say we allow the Iraqis to give it a try?;)
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Murph,

    Putting aside the fact that out of the 21 countries the US has bombed since the end of WWII not a single one has been 'liberated' and learned the wonders of true democracy as a result (and frankly the chances of Iraq becoming a "vibrant democracy" are no better) you might want to ask yourself how wonderful this "democracy" is that we must impose it on other nations.

    You might be surprised to know that a number of nations and its inhabitants are fairly happy with their current regimes and they can do just fine without a democracy, thank you very much. Not that this is the case on Iraq of course, but before you praise your government for enlightening people all over the world think the real reasons Bush is attacking other sovereign nations, and at what cost.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    That very attitude is what is increasingly alienating the US from the rest of the world, Murph.

    To presume that it is for us to "allow" (or, by inference, "deny") democracy to any other people or nation is the kind of arrogant almighty benefactor image that is being broadcasted almost daily now to a world who is well aware of our long running, and continuing, foreign policy hypocrisies.

    We do not own the world Murph, we have our nation as others have theirs, repleat with traditions and values that do not and should not necessarily mesh. Appreciating that fact is the first step to learning respect. We have long sought to sidestep respect by presuming that a coke and a smile solves all ills. Sorry to say, it doesnt. As it was said "the business of America is business", not "liberation". Not everyone wants to buy what Washington is trying to sell.

    Democracy if it is to be anything more than a thin veil for US interest can only rise from the determined will of any people. To even suggest that "we" can bestow our image of society on nations with vastly differing historical realities let alone cultures, is to expose the claim for the mockery it is.

    If the American public want to impact the world's attititudes than they had better start by closing their ears to the BS and rhetorical spin and start learning that the international community is not our mosh pit.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Tartars have been under Russian rule since 16th century. Occupy Iraq, wait four or five hundred years and no doubt it will be ready for democracy.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Originally posted by Murph the Surf
    clandestine,

    Democracy is a rather novel concept. What say we allow the Iraqis to give it a try?;)

    When on another thread you were portrsying the Iraqi's as barborous murderers......

    Wierd......:confused:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Putting aside the fact that out of the 21 countries the US has bombed since the end of WWII not a single one has been 'liberated' and learned the wonders of true democracy as a result

    Japan, Germany, the Philippines and because we won the Cold war...Eastern Europe and Russia...to name a few Aladdin.

    The debate over democracy is a moot point. The Arab world will have democracies. The days of perverting the Muslim religion into a death cult are over. I just wish it could be done diplomatically. I hate to see innocents on both sides killed.

    And as always, the largely Christian United State will set the moral agenda by stepping in to prevent the genocide of Shiite Muslims...which the UN stood by and watched...and the Sunni Muslim Kurds...which the UN stood by and watched...and mandated to the US during the last Gulf war not to interfere with: Saddam was to be pushed out of Kuwait but left in power. That was the UN's mandate.

    Just remember one thing Aladdin: Saddam has killed more Muslims than anyone in the last two centuries. And I'm tired of the Arab street being ignorant to that.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    The Phillipines was a conqured nation.

    Eastern Europe liberated itself.

    Germany had lost a war of agression which it had started and was then split in two and half run by a violent dictatorship for 45 years (forget that bit?)

    Japan also lost a war of agression that it started itself.

    The US chose not to get rid of Saddam at the end of GW1, theye wrere not forced into anything by the UN, unless you have some evidence otherwise?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    The arab street is not ignorant of Saddam pnj, but they are equally well versed in the hypcorisies of US foreign policy which, marching to its corporate drumbeat, has impoverished or been directly responsible for installing those who have impoverished, tortured, and or killed any who stood in their way or were even perceived as being any threat to that status quo.

    Get your facts, your history and your geo-political perspectives straight and stop being so easily propogandized by the sanitised spin and drivel you are fed on the evening news. Much of the world sees far more of what we have done and continue to do around the globe than you care to imagine.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,324 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Oh Alladin I want the Muslims to be free and not tortured.
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