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pregnancy related sickness at work
Former Member
Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
in Work & Study
I'll try not to moan or go off on a tangeant here and stick to the bare facts.
I work at a supermarket and am still on my 12 week probationary period until 17 August. I found out I was pregnant not so long ago. I was going to wait until the 12 weeks were up before I even considered telling work but I had to leave work early one day when I had a scare and had to tell them. They haven't been very considerate since.
I've had 3 to 4 days off of work for 'morning' sickness. I rang in on time and told them it was morning sickness and they have that on record. Yesterday I was pulled in for a 'back to work' interview. My absence rate was mentioned (7%) when the max should be 3%. I'm now on a red form (dun dun dunn) which was explained could lead to disciplinary action.
7% seems like a lot but my contract is one day a week so it seems like more than it is.
I told the guy doing it that I'm sure that isn't right. Pregnancy related sickness shouldn't be counted like that and is different from normal absence. He said they still counted it as sickness.
After 5 seconds of googling 'pregnancy related sickness'. I can see that theyre wrong. I shouldn't be on a red form or being threatened with disciplinary action. Pregnancy related sickness has to be recorded seperately as well.
The thing is during the meeting I had to sign the forms saying I understood which sounds pretty bad but... on the forms they have even recorded the reason for my absence as 'pregnancy related sickness'. Surely they dont have a leg to stand on?
I'm so confused. This is a big supermarket. Either they are very very thick. Or they think I am very very thick. I'm unsure what to do next. It's obvious they want to use my time off for morning sickness as a basis for sacking me after my probationary period.
Any help would be so appreciated
I work at a supermarket and am still on my 12 week probationary period until 17 August. I found out I was pregnant not so long ago. I was going to wait until the 12 weeks were up before I even considered telling work but I had to leave work early one day when I had a scare and had to tell them. They haven't been very considerate since.
I've had 3 to 4 days off of work for 'morning' sickness. I rang in on time and told them it was morning sickness and they have that on record. Yesterday I was pulled in for a 'back to work' interview. My absence rate was mentioned (7%) when the max should be 3%. I'm now on a red form (dun dun dunn) which was explained could lead to disciplinary action.
7% seems like a lot but my contract is one day a week so it seems like more than it is.
I told the guy doing it that I'm sure that isn't right. Pregnancy related sickness shouldn't be counted like that and is different from normal absence. He said they still counted it as sickness.
After 5 seconds of googling 'pregnancy related sickness'. I can see that theyre wrong. I shouldn't be on a red form or being threatened with disciplinary action. Pregnancy related sickness has to be recorded seperately as well.
The thing is during the meeting I had to sign the forms saying I understood which sounds pretty bad but... on the forms they have even recorded the reason for my absence as 'pregnancy related sickness'. Surely they dont have a leg to stand on?
I'm so confused. This is a big supermarket. Either they are very very thick. Or they think I am very very thick. I'm unsure what to do next. It's obvious they want to use my time off for morning sickness as a basis for sacking me after my probationary period.
Any help would be so appreciated
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Some info:
http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/england/work_e/work_discrimination_e/discrimination_at_work_because_of_pregnancy_or_maternity_leave.htm#time_off_sick_for_pregnancy_and_your_sickness_record
Either they don't realise this, and you should tell them, or they DO realise, and are trying to pull a fast one! This is what I meant about knowing your rights inside out. I don't know if you've had a booking appointment with a midwife yet, but usually they give you a little bit of info at that point about your employment rights, and that booklet has LOADS of really good links to places you can get advice or just read through what they can and can't do to you. If you are pedantic, like moi, there's even a rip-off section you can hand to your employer to get them up to speed
The good thing is they have it on record as being 'morning sickness' and I've seen the form. It's just so ridiculous to think a major company isn't aware of the legislation. No idea how that form is even going to make it part HR.
Wish I had that booklet. I am seeing there on Tuesday for another group welcome thing for the new arrivals and will speak to someone from the People's Team then. If they try to blag it again saying that it does count then I'll just take out my phone and google it for them. It's beyond stupid
My suggestion is to print out something along the lines of the site I linked to - the more official the better, try direct.gov, and hand the printed sheet to them the next time they try to suggest that you are wrong. I also found casually suggesting you have had professional advice and/or asking to speak to a HR manager also works pretty well!
Unfortunately, in my experience, you have to throw your weight around a little bit to avoid being walked over! You don't need to be difficult, just calmly but confidently tell them you know your rights, you believe that they are in the wrong and you are able and willing to prove it if necessary.
ETA: the employment thing might not be standard for the booking appt, but they should know if you ask about it. They always go though it here, but from talking to friends from other areas, I think our Community Midwives are especially good.
Bear in mind, of course, that sex discrimination due to pregnancy is a protected class of employment law, meaning that you can go to an employment tribunal at any time. The "probation" is a smokescreen.
I'm unsure what my next move should be now. I'm in tomorrow for another day as part of my induction to the company. I could ask to see someone from HR then or should I wait until it's mentioned again? Though I imagine that wont be until the end of my probation when they try to sack me. I think taking a print out is a good idea and speaking to the HR manager would be good if she was decent. She's the lady I saw last time who used inaudible answers to everything like 'ya' 'hm' and 'mhm' because she wanted me out of her office.
AR how do you mean the probation is a smoke screen? They do it for all new employees. Is it a good idea to contact the employment tribunal now?
It's difficult not to take it personally. Seems like theyre going to a lot of effort not to have me working there.
I don't know which chain you work for, but you might want to find out whether they recognise a trade union that you can join. When I worked at Tesco they recognised USDAW; that means you can get your shop steward involved if necessary.
Try to ignore any verbal 'scare' tactics they use, any action to terminate your employment will need to be done in writing. Where possible, if they try to give you any warnings about attendance ask them to be put in writing to you and put your replies in writing to them. Don't sign any 'personal improvements plans' or similar without taking them away to read through. As AR says, try to contact your union (involving them can sometimes make incompetent HR folk re read absence procedures and realise they're not following protocol).
I'm in today and will ask to see the HR manager if she's even in but I'm not holding up much hope. I would ignore it if it's a verbal scare tactic but I'm most concerned about being on that stupid red form which they have no right to put me on. I think if they refuse to take me off of it then I'll ask for a copy to be made of it and then take it further.
SM I wont go in there with guns blazing or acting really angry. The red form is official because it's part of their procedure. I've already bypassed yellow and orange and now am on the most severe form.
I just want them to know that I won't be a walkover. I hate the idea of working there, makes me feel physically sick. If I do get sacked at the end of my probation then I will take it to a tribunal. And my last word to them will be that I hope if they ever decide to have children that they have a care and stress free first trimester. And I hope the company treats them with the same consideration as they have with me.
I didnt get to see the manager because she was 'busy' so I saw someone else. She said she understood that pregnancy related absence is different from normal absence but they still record it in the same way. I said that I was concerned about being on a red form and also the meeting I had and she said that no action would be taken, that meeting was just a way of 'touching base' with me.
I said I was worried about it being used as a reason to dismiss me at the end of my probationary period and she reminded me that it was a temporary contract and I immediately thought of what AR said about it being a smokescreen.
Still sounds sketchy but there isnt any more I can do until I find out if they are going to keep me on or not. Im finding it doubtful but I should find out relatively soon as my contract finishes on 17 August.
Thanks for everyone's help and advice so far
Had a meeting with the HR Manager today and the bitch of a supervisor and they are not continuing my contract because of my 3 absences. (All of which are pregnancy related). And flexibility (because I called in sick for overtime).
Really pathetic meeting. HR Manager was writing down what we were saying by hand so it went so slowly because she kept on having to say stop ever 4 words. Told them that I thought this wouldn't be happening if I wasn't pregnant and they used the 'We let quite a few people go..Wages blah blah' routine.
Asked for a copy of the minutes to be sent to me.
Starting point would be to check what they've put in there and if it's all illness related. Then decide how much you fancy picking a fight/whether it's worth the grief.
If you email me more information can always help you draft a pissy letter.
I had a read of it because I had to sign it, that's when I asked for a copy of it. Their reasons were my 3 absences (all recorded as pregnancy related) and my flexibility (they said before that it was because one of the times I called in sick was for an overtime shift). I have a feeling flexibility will come back to bite me, my contract is for one shift and whilst having pregnancy related sickness I haven't applied for any overtime because I didn't see the point.
Definitely taking it further.
FireyFirenze- I see what you're saying but I didn't hate it until the supervisor was cruel to me when I had my miscarriage scare. Then I started to dread going in because I didn't feel safe.
I can't even use them as a reference now. I didn't do anything wrong apart from be absent on those 3 occassions which I couldn't have helped whatsoever. They said before that everything else was fine including my uniform and my scan speeds on the till. I got good feedback from the customers and the team around me liked me. I just hate the management.
Having second thoughts. I know it's the right thing to do but going to yet another meeting at the supermarket with the same stupid people making me out to be some work shy fiend isn't what I really wanna do right now.
You're entitled to be accompanied to these meetings; if you don't have a CAB adviser available or a union rep (I assume not, given you weren't there long?) then just take a mate for moral support.
I cant unfortunately. I had a look at their guidelines for appeals and it has to be a rep or someone that works there. I wasn't there long enough to make an actual friend.
Worth taking it a bit further if you had a permanent contract, if it is a major company they may well offer some money to avoid the embarrassment of an Employment Tribunal. But before you can do that you need to explore the appeals procedure. They should have stated exactly what it is that they have dismissed you for, bearing in mind that they cannot sanction you for pregnancy-related illness.
It was a temporary contract with the disclaimer that I could be taken on a permanent contract at the end of my 12 week probationary period. During the meeting they said it was because of my absence (all of which are recorded as pregnancy sickness) and 'flexibility' which previously had been explained to me as 'because you called in sick for a shift that you had applied to do over time on' but during the last meeting they mentioned that they took me on for my flexibility being 7 days a week. But again surely, if I'm feeling and being sick all day, I'm not going to apply for overtime?
As I say, speak to ACAS, unless you're speaking to a specialist adviser at the CAB. With the best will in the world, the generalists there know diddly squat.
'This employment will continue until 17 August 2012. This offer can be terminated at any time within that period, subject to the normal notice period being given where necessary as outlined in your terms and conditions of employment. Should a permanent vacancy occur in the meantime you may be considered for permanent employment'.
Although during my introduction sessions to the company it was stated several times that they hoped to keep us all on unless we gave them a reason not to.
I rang ACAS just now. She said the important thing is whether I felt that I had been discriminated against because of pregnancy and they suggested contacting the Equality and Human Rights Commission so I've emailed them.
I'm quite lucky because my boyfriend's mum works at a soliciters office and she said that 'It doesn't matter that she was in her trial period - you aren't allowed to treat an employee unfavourably due to preganancy at any time even within the first year' which made me hopeful.
It's left me more financially weak if that was ever possible. It's looking like I won't be entitled to any maternity benefits because I wasn't employed long enough.
You're best off ringing them tbh