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Body image and fashion

**helen****helen** Deactivated Posts: 9,235 Supreme Poster
Does body image get in the way of enjoying style?

Chloe wishes we worried about it less.

What are your views on the subject?

Comments

  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    i try not to worry about it too much, but then again i'm not really a fashion freak.

    :lol:

    i guess it can interupt your enjoyment in a way, because if there's something that you really want to wear that's not really suited to your image, then it kind of spoils the look.

    there are always plenty of options, so i try not to think about it.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Just one thing....

    I get that there may be some sort of link between media portrayal and eating disorders... but I don't think its as black and white as that. I think the media is partially to blame for people's warped views on body image, however I think it is wrong to assume everyone with an eating disorder has those problems because of pressure from the media to be the right size. Problems with food can stem from feelings of not being able to cope, or people feeling out of control of their lives, which then results in issues surrounding food and weight... and so actually in these cases it has nothing to do with celebrities, the fashion industry etc.
  • Indrid ColdIndrid Cold Posts: 16,688 Skive's The Limit
    Go Chloe!
  • **helen****helen** Deactivated Posts: 9,235 Supreme Poster
    Just one thing....

    I get that there may be some sort of link between media portrayal and eating disorders... but I don't think its as black and white as that. I think the media is partially to blame for people's warped views on body image, however I think it is wrong to assume everyone with an eating disorder has those problems because of pressure from the media to be the right size. Problems with food can stem from feelings of not being able to cope, or people feeling out of control of their lives, which then results in issues surrounding food and weight... and so actually in these cases it has nothing to do with celebrities, the fashion industry etc.

    :yes: really interesting topic.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    **helen** wrote: »
    Does body image get in the way of enjoying style?

    Chloe wishes we worried about it less.

    What are your views on the subject?
    I care baout body image alot beacause it sometimes expresses who you are and everything the way you dress type and everything people will judge us on that well thats how most people do
    Xx
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    **helen** wrote: »
    :yes: really interesting topic.

    Agreed :yes:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fashion is temporary, style is permanent.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I reckon a link to the article would do well in P&D. :d
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    **Annie** wrote: »
    I care baout body image alot beacause it sometimes expresses who you are and everything the way you dress type and everything people will judge us on that well thats how most people do
    Xx

    :yes: before you meet someone you can and iea of what type of person they are by how they dress and look.
    I care about my body image a lot.
  • **helen****helen** Deactivated Posts: 9,235 Supreme Poster
    I reckon a link to the article would do well in P&D. :d

    Blame ^ for the move ;)
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    hidden.. wrote: »
    :yes: before you meet someone you can and iea of what type of person they are by how they dress and look.
    I care about my body image a lot.

    Agree and disagree. You might be able to tell certain things about them - profession perhaps. Maybe at the extremes of dress you might be able make a good guess at certain other things: musical taste, sexual persuasion (I've got Brighton Pride still on the mind), etc. But to tell the 'type of person' they are? I'm sceptical of that.

    ETA: As usual, I disagree with large parts of what the ranter is saying. :d
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I read it, spotted the missing apostrophes but, can't be arsed to point them out - must be something wrong with me, no enthusiasm, must be PMT. LOL
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    **helen** wrote: »
    Blame ^ for the move ;)

    LOL :lol:
  • Indrid ColdIndrid Cold Posts: 16,688 Skive's The Limit
    I think looking good is good, but in the scale of importance it comes below comfort.

    In other words: If something you do to look good causes you discomfort (directly), I think you should just not do it.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I get that there may be some sort of link between media portrayal and eating disorders... but I don't think its as black and white as that. I think the media is partially to blame for people's warped views on body image, however I think it is wrong to assume everyone with an eating disorder has those problems because of pressure from the media to be the right size. Problems with food can stem from feelings of not being able to cope, or people feeling out of control of their lives, which then results in issues surrounding food and weight... and so actually in these cases it has nothing to do with celebrities, the fashion industry etc.

    exactly. it's quite narrow-minded to assume that eating disorders are caused solely by the media. it's most likely that a person has a psychological or biological vulnerability to an eating disorder which is triggered or worsened by the media's portrayal of thin celebrities. if it was all because of the media then everyone who is exposed to the media (practically everyone) would become ill.

    i think chloe needs to do a bit more research :yes:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    omg hi wrote: »
    exactly. it's quite narrow-minded to assume that eating disorders are caused solely by the media. it's most likely that a person has a psychological or biological vulnerability to an eating disorder which is triggered or worsened by the media's portrayal of thin celebrities. if it was all because of the media then everyone who is exposed to the media (practically everyone) would become ill.

    i think chloe needs to do a bit more research :yes:

    You're right insofar as there are undoubtedly underlying psychological, possibly physiological factors which trigger the eating disorder. Some people unfortunately just happen to have a predisposition toward mental illness.

    However, the fact that it manifests itself as an eating disorder, and not as something else, is clearly a social and cultural by-product. Anorexia is something that people in affluent post-industrial societies suffer from. It didn't occur 200 years ago*; there are countries where it still doesn't.

    The fact that vulnerable people with a tendency toward mental illness and self-destructive behaviour frequently turn toward eating disorders is definitely caused by social and cultural factors; of which the media is one hugely important one, I would say.

    *Obviously this is not to claim that people did not starve themselves 200 years ago. Just that it was a different phenomenon and a different disease, in the same way that hunger strike and anorexia are not the same thing.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    jamelia wrote: »
    The fact that vulnerable people with a tendency toward mental illness and self-destructive behaviour frequently turn toward eating disorders is definitely caused by social and cultural factors; of which the media is one hugely important one, I would say.

    I agree with what you're saying about someone predesposed to mental illness being more likely to develop an eating disorder, rather than other behaviour, because of the media... I can see that being possible.

    However, I think that there are cases of anorexia where the person would have developed an eating disorder whatever the socio-cultural factors. I believe that eating disorders *do* exist in most, if not all, societies. Definitely on a much smaller scale than here in the UK, and in the West, but I don't believe that it is an exclusively cultural problem.

    I remember reading things about various groups of people being found to have incidents of eating disorders.. I've googled, but could only find this rather outdated article.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Agree and disagree. You might be able to tell certain things about them - profession perhaps. Maybe at the extremes of dress you might be able make a good guess at certain other things: musical taste, sexual persuasion (I've got Brighton Pride still on the mind), etc. But to tell the 'type of person' they are? I'm sceptical of that.

    ETA: As usual, I disagree with large parts of what the ranter is saying. :d

    agree too. plus the view that we can judge a person by how they look or what they are wearing doesn't really take into account that people have bad days maybe when they want to cover up or wear something that isn't going to attract attention. but then, if i feel shit even if im in an amazing dress, im gonna radiate general shitness.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I think fashion is hollow and only exists due to pop culture, but I sometimes think that people who put their value on appearance have little else to show or offer. If they got ugly would they hang themselves? Human beings are more than appearance, we have other traits and abilities.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fashion is temporary, style is permanent.

    Clothes exist due to modesty and protection from the elements. When they do we need to wear clothes for style? What about people who don't give a hoot about artistic expression? Isn't the only justification for fashion artistic expression?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Okay...

    "As a lover of fashion, I think it's important to present yourself well on every occasion. I love to keep up with trends and play about with outfits and I think fashion is a beautiful thing because it allows us to express ourselves."

    I'm pleased for you.

    "But the attention we give to dress sizes is ruining all the fun for me. Having the right figure has way too much importance in our culture, for men and women alike. All I hear are other girls my age worrying about how fat and ugly they are."

    That's right. And where does most of the criticism come from, ask yourself? 99% of the time, what I usually see are women slagging off the weight and appearance of other women. Very rarely do I see it coming from men. And before anyone mentions "oh, but men run the media" - even if they do, they are publishing what women want to see. Women make up the vast bulk of the readers of celebrity magazines and increasingly for newspapers. The Daily Mail has the largest female audience of any UK newspaper and one of the largest on the internet, hence why they feature loads of stories about women and their appearance. It's not just because Paul Dacre is a misogynistic dick.

    "There's even been a point where Ive even looked at myself and wondered Am I too big? Do I need to lose weight? then luckily - I realised how ridiculous I was being."

    You're pretty easy on the eye from what I can see, so I wouldn't say you've any need to worry about that.

    *cue complaints I'm now being patronising/sexist/accusation that I eat babies for breakfast*

    "It's tragic that we care so much about size. Being a fashion lover myself it pains me to say this, but it's obvious the fashion world contributes to people getting eating disorders."

    Please elaborate.

    "Somehow, we need to change that. Statistics show that anorexia is on the rise. In 1996-97, 419 people suffered from anorexia, while in 2005-06, 620 people suffered from the same condition."

    Might better awareness of this horrible illness not be a better explanation for this?

    "In my opinion, the press coverage of our bodies is to blame for eating disorders. I'm sick of seeing celebrities mocked for eating a take-away or wearing a tracksuit. They're just humans, not super humans. Maybe if appearance wasn't such an overly-discussed topic, people wouldn't care so much about fitting into tiny clothing?"

    See point 2 again. In addition to that, there is a very simple solution if people are so worried. Don't buy the newspapers that feature this kind of trash. Don't visit the websites. Hit companies where it really hurts, and they'll quickly make changes.

    "What people dont seem to realise is that weight is a scale, with anorexia at one end and obesity at the other. There's no perfect in between, because everyone is different, from our personalities all the way to our bones. What's important, especially for young people, is that we focus on being healthy - not on being too fat or too thin. Healthy means eating a balanced diet and regular meals and exercise, not starving ourselves, binge eating or cutting out certain aspects of our diet just because the media says we should."

    The media says a lot of things. Do we have to do everything it says? People should decide their own destiny.

    "One person who demonstrated a great attitude to fashion and lifestyle was Sophie Dahl, a plus sized model who inspired many people because she was stunning but didn't have the perfect body. Sadly these days even Sophie is much thinner and has conformed to the supposed perfect body image the media pressurises us to have. We can no longer look to her to be a role model."

    And why not? Perhaps there are legitimiate reasons for Sophie Dahl deciding to lose some weight. It might simply be that she's working all the time and not eating as much as before. Who knows what the reason is? And who says she's a role model anyway?

    "On the other hand, there are a few glimmers of hope things might be changing. I was pleased to find out that some fashion magazines are beginning to recognise the need to show differently sized women are beautiful and are using a range of different models, including plus size. Designer Mark Fast shocked the fashion empire at London Fashion Week when he presented designs using size 12-14 models."

    Hang on a minute. You've spent the last few minutes telling us that women's size doesn't matter, but now there you are using some ghastly phrase "differently sized women". Unless I've been misled, the average dress size of British women is a size 16. Using your choice of terminology, one could argue that women who are a size 4 or 6 are "differently sized women", not the ones who are up at around sizes 14 and 16.

    As for the designers, I do hope you're not under the impression they've had some kind of Damascean conversion. For years, they could produce any old crap, knowing it would sell. Now that people don't have as much money as before, they're having to widen their ranges in order to survive. It's everything to do with money.

    "I believe being too thin or too fat is not important. Each of us, with our different sizes, can buy and wear beautiful clothes. We needn't try and conform to an image, just because the media tells us to."

    We need not confirm to most things we're told, and especially not to what we're told by the media.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I only got as far as
    As a lover of fashion, I think it's important to present yourself well on every occasion. I love to keep up with trends and play about with outfits and I think fashion is a beautiful thing because it allows us to express ourselves.

    before I face-palmed.

    Chloe is at pains to stress she doesn't agree with the importance she thinks is placed on people's weight - an opinion she's so keen adopt entirely she ceases thinking and states 'I believe being too thin or too fat is not important'.

    I suspect Chloe isn't that fussed about how much people weigh, but step out wearing the wrong label or inappropriately dressed in her group of friends and you'll see a lot less of her overly-liberal side.

    ETA: I'm slightly ashamed of myself for being so curt with a seventeen year-old. And now I'm a little more ashamed for being so patronising.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Chloe wrote:
    I love to keep up with trends
    ...
    I think fashion is a beautiful thing because it allows us to express ourselves.

    Mmm sweet delicious irony. Expressing yourself, your individuality, by dressing exactly how you're told to by some magazine or other source.

    Warm fuzzy irony.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Body size gets in the way of enjoying style. It's hard to find clothes if you're a size 16+
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Namaste wrote: »
    Body size gets in the way of enjoying style. It's hard to find clothes if you're a size 16+

    And equally hard if you're less than an 8.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    It's also difficult when your boobs are big for your size. Fashion seems to assume that if you're a size 10 then your boobs are a C cup or smaller. And I've been told it's just as bad if you have really small boobs too. We women can't win. :(
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fashion is temporary, style is permanent.

    I like that.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Just one thing....

    I get that there may be some sort of link between media portrayal and eating disorders... but I don't think its as black and white as that. I think the media is partially to blame for people's warped views on body image, however I think it is wrong to assume everyone with an eating disorder has those problems because of pressure from the media to be the right size. Problems with food can stem from feelings of not being able to cope, or people feeling out of control of their lives, which then results in issues surrounding food and weight... and so actually in these cases it has nothing to do with celebrities, the fashion industry etc.

    Right. Many, MANY cases of eating disorders stem from a need to be in control. The feeling that how much food they put into their mouths/how much weight they gain or lose is one of the ONLY things in life they have complete control over. Some studies indicate is can be hereditary, too.

    However, there are also many studies that show that gender, ethnicity and socio-economic status were large influences on the chance of developing an eating disorder (mainly anorexia). Further research suggested that those with anorexia have much higher contact with cultural sources that promote weight-loss, ie, images in the media. This was a very large scale study, and certainly not a stand alone one.
    If you'd like me to try and find the study I'm referring to, I'd be happy to.

    So, while I of course don't believe that fashion and celebrities are the sole cause of all eating disorders (that would be incredibly ignorant), I've educated myself enough on the matter to come to the understanding that it plays a HUGE role in the development of such illnesses. Possibly a larger role on a much wider scale than any other causation.
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