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Sexist language

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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    ...female circumcision does happen within somali and minority groups within the UK, and is a big problem, forced marriages are happening and don't just happen to those from asian backgrounds. why does nobody else see this stuff?
    Oh, they know full well it goes on, Trinity. But the authorities daren't say anything because some rent-a-gob will complain that we are intruding on "their culture" (a patronising enough phrase as it is) or that we're being "racist".
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    why the fuck would they were little girls as young as 7 are stitched up and cut up? it is illegal here, and there are posters around newham (part of east london i used to live in) saying so...

    Girls from upper middle class background still get forced into loveless marriages that make their families look better...not to meantion, romany girls, many african cultures etc...

    what it comes down to is stupid political correctness bending what is actually right...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    stargalaxy wrote: »
    Oh, they know full well it goes on, Trinity. But the authorities daren't say anything because some rent-a-gob will complain that we are intruding on "their culture" (a patronising enough phrase as it is) or that we're being "racist".
    Yes.

    Too often we tend to define culture by what the patriarchs of that section of society say or do. Politicians are so afraid of offending somebody or being called racist some pander to the more right wing of them. How annoying. :yeees:

    There are groups who exist though, like Southall Black Sisters, who help a lot of these women. However, they were threatened by budget cuts before, but are still going... So far as I know. :thumb:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Namaste wrote: »
    Yes. Too often we tend to define culture by what the patriarchs of that section of society say or do.
    Yep. Hence why Muslims, for example, get a seriously bad press. Some bearded nutjob says that people must die for offending Islam, and the image goes out that Muslims are violent and dangerous. And what do the authorities do when they get the opportunity to confront this, to make a real difference? Why, they ban a person with views critical of Islam from the UK! Yes, that'll make a real difference, won't it - just pretend that the people making the criticisms don't exist!

    Thankfully, even African countries where some of this originated are getting the message and banning the practice. Eritrea did in 2007, Egypt did in 2004, and doubtless there will be more. Altogether, it's estimated there are over 2 million female circumcisions carried out every year - most of these in dangerously unsafe conditions. How many more women will not be able to tell of the horrors that have happened to them, for fear of being disowned by their families? For fear of violent retribution or death if they expose the truth?

    More about the brutal horrors of female circumcision here, if anyone is curious.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    In the last district hospital I was at, there was a policy in place to go and remind mothers (on the post-natal ward where they're recovering from childbirth, how lovely) that genital cutting in the UK is illegal and wrong. From a health promotion perspective, I understand why they have to do it, don't think it'll make the slightest bit of difference though.

    Interestingly a few years ago (I think it was in Boston) a doctor had either proposed or set up a practice where he would make a small nick in the clitoral hood of women, under sterile conditions, allowing them to have the ritual, but not as drastic or dangerous as infibulation. People found out about this and threw their hands up in moral outrage and it was promptly stopped. After this, the mothers were taking their daughters to Africa for infibulation.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    i can't believe i missed that...

    what planet are you on?

    there is a hell of a lot of abuse in the country and the figures just keep rising every year, female circumcision does happen within somali and minority groups within the UK, and is a big problem, forced marriages are happening and don't just happen to those from asian backgrounds.

    why does nobody else see this stuff? its well enough reported but yet everyone glides over it.
    I certainly have heard of big problems with arranged marriages though as I understood it, it involved women being sent back to their ethnic background countries to get married off there. Nor that it makes it any more acceptable of course, but I genuinely wasn't aware of any such activities taking place in the UK- certainly regarding female circumcision.

    Let me assure you I don't make light of such matters. I was simply suggesting the article writer was concentrating on every day life for the average person in Britain and what they encounter in their daily lives, rather than the plight of women in general.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I think you mean forced marriages, arranged are different and often involve no more than two sets of parents getting their children together to see if they click.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    many women, especially asian business women are going back to arranged marriages, because they want to find someone to love and get married to but don't have the time for dating, and thus let their parents find suitors...

    i wouldn't but it makes sense...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    .
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    Indrid ColdIndrid Cold Posts: 16,688 Skive's The Limit
    I've thought about it too actually. I do think that the word "Mrs" in English is very sexist, and as for the custom of married women changing their surname (which also happens here) I think it's the same.
    In fact I've often thought about changing my name if I get married (although it's probably unlikely) for no reason other than to break a stupid custom.
    As for children's names, I had the following idea when I was little (about 10): what if sons got their father's surname and daughters their mother's?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    As for children's names, I had the following idea when I was little (about 10): what if sons got their father's surname and daughters their mother's?

    The parents of a friend of mine did that. They also lied to their children about being married (they were hippies and very anti-establishment, but married so the grandparents wouldn't have heart attacks when babies came along). When my friend was 13, her parents sat her and her brother down and said, "What do we think about little white lies?" :lol:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I've thought about it too actually. I do think that the word "Mrs" in English is very sexist, and as for the custom of married women changing their surname (which also happens here) I think it's the same.
    In fact I've often thought about changing my name if I get married (although it's probably unlikely) for no reason other than to break a stupid custom.
    As for children's names, I had the following idea when I was little (about 10): what if sons got their father's surname and daughters their mother's?

    I've considered changing my name too actually, as it would be quite nice for the name to be the same so you are recognised as the same family in a way. Unfortunately if that's what you want either a woman will have to change her surname or a man will have to chnage his, there's not really a middle ground except not changing your name. But I think people get too het up over surnames. They originally just were your fathers name, you only got first names and then your second name was who your father was. Sometimes people's second name was their profession.

    Maybe it's because I'm a man so it's not something I'm expected to do but I just don't see it as an issue :confused:. It's like when I was looking at racism and considering that for example, The Lord of the Rings can be construed as racist because the good guys are all described as European-Caucasion and the bad guys are all described pretty much as Indo-African (orcs = african, haradrim = indian). Star Wars describes the battle between the 'dark side' represented by Darth Vader who is dressed in complete black, and the 'light side' being luke skywalker wearing white etc...

    Maybe it's because it's racist, or maybe it's symptomatic of the environment these works / ideas were founded in. So maybe the Mrs and adoption of surnames is something that came about because of the patriarchal system but in itself I see it as harmless - particularly now because women have the freedom to decide what they would like to be called for themselves.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I can't wait to get married so I don't have to have my last name anymore, I don't like it!
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Not much to add really but my mum kept her maiden name when she married my dad and so referred to herself as a 'Ms'. This enfuriated his strict, religious parents and I think this was partly the reason why she did it :p I asked her about it and her reason for it was because of the historical connotation about becoming your husband's property. I see GWST's point though, keeping a name given to you by your dad is just maintaining the patriarchal order of things. Personally I dont know whether I'd change my surname, it all depends on when I get married whether the bloke has a decent surname or not :p Oh the shallowness.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    ShyBoy wrote: »
    It's like when I was looking at racism and considering that for example, The Lord of the Rings can be construed as racist because the good guys are all described as European-Caucasion and the bad guys are all described pretty much as Indo-African (orcs = african, haradrim = indian). Star Wars describes the battle between the 'dark side' represented by Darth Vader who is dressed in complete black, and the 'light side' being luke skywalker wearing white etc...

    For centuries, people (of ANY colour) have been scared of the 'black' night, the 'black' things that go bump in the night and the dark, shadowy figures that may move about at night too. Mordor and its inhabitants are just extensions of this 'traditional' fear. Its got nothing to do with racism. If you REALLY think an orc as described in LOTR looks like a Black man, then I'm afraid you're the 'racist' with some weird version of stereo-typing. ;)

    Adding the 'Oliphants' and the 'Easterlings' etc was probably just to make the story seem more 'exotic'. Racists tend to be consistently racist and so pulling out a few passages from LOTR rather than looking at Tolkien's life as a whole, seems a bit unfair.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Star Wars also has white stormtroopers - unless you think its also racist against albinos - I'd say you're reading way too much into it
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    that was my point :p

    just because something can be construed as '....ist' doesn't mean it is! Though you can find lots of ideas about Tolkien just like you can find lots of ideas about Mrs just by doing a google for 'Tolkien Racist'.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I put in "peanut butter" and "racist" into Google and got over 429 000 hits. Won't stop me eating peanut butter! ;):p:)
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