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Sexist language
**helen**
Deactivated Posts: 9,235 Supreme Poster
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In fact I find it an extraordinary, derogatory, draconian, patronising and demeaning tradition. To hell with with the family history of the woman getting married. She's now the 'property' of the husband, and tagged just as that.
I'm very unlikely to ever get married, but if I did I would neither expect nor want my partner to take my name.
'Appalled'? Like you would feel 'appalled' by, say, female circumcision?
Aladdin: How do kids get their surnames in Spain? I think I've read it somewhere but don't remember now.
And then goes onto say about woman having 'man' in it. Whilst it may not be ideal, it's the accepted norm, it's hardly 'hidden oppression' when you consider what oppression really is.
I don't really have an opinion on the mr / mrs thing, probably because I'm a man. I think a woman is entitled to call herself miss / mrs / ms / dr / el presidente or whatever. With all the real issues facing women around the world I would have picked something a bit more prominent than the word mrs.
Like female circumcision perhaps. I am probably being naive but I don't see how being a mrs or a miss or a ms is grossly depriving women of their human rights. In some cultures it goes the other way and men take the women's surname, is that grossly depriving those men of their human rights? Probably not.
I personally don't feel repressed at all - by anyone - so it wouldn't make me feel that way if I took my partners name
As for losing your identity - I think the new identity you've created by marrying the person you love is a wonderful thing.
I'd find it derogatory and demeaning if I was FORCED to get married and FORCED to take my partner's name but that's not the case. You have a choice - if you don't want to change your name then don't do it.
The whole tradition of marriage and the laws that go alongside it is incredibly old fashioned IMO, not just the names part
I think looking at isolated things like words misses the bigger picture that society has had for a long time and still has ideas about what being a 'man' and a 'woman' is, and until they are gone completely people will still feel like they need to fit a certain stereotype to a greater or lesser extent. But it's endemic to whole society - the majority of teachers in school are female for example further reinforcing this 'mother' portayal of women to children in particular. I think there should be a big national drive to get more men into teaching because it's important to have that balance at a developmental stage.
On top of that I think the sexualisation of women should be curbed so they are not seen as sex objects, you only need to watch adverts for 5 minutes to see how obvious it is. Even here on thesite when they were doing the redesign not too long ago, they had a skinny girl in a bra on one of the proposed pages. It is unfortunate that sex sells but as long as we continue to allow this prescribed role of what a woman should be (a sex object, should be submissive, should look after children etc.) and what a man should be (should go to work, should be the 'bread winner', needs to be strong and assertive) the whole cycle just reinforces itself.
I won't be changing my name if I get married as a) I like it and b) my status will be Dr and that makes it a lot easier (until I become a surgeon). Can't really say I'm bothered about the choices other people make, so long as the choice is available to them.
I dunno, I've just sat in an HIV clinic so thinking about the invisible cloak of oppression in perspective just makes me feel that some individuals are lucky enough to be able to worry about things like, "Mrs/Miss/Ms"
The first surname is inherited from your father (his first surname). The second from your mother (her first surname).
I went out with a Spanish guy, both of his surnames were identical
Bit hypocritical - claiming how terrible the British practice is and then saying that in Spain the first (father's name) is the most important one.
Is it the fathers first surname or the mothers first surname that becomes the childs first surname?
If its always the fathers first, then the child will have the two names of his grandfathers first surnames as his surname, but none of his grandmothers surnames.
In Iceland (and some other places), a persons surname is literally "Dad's name"'s son/daughter.
eg: Eidur Gudjonson's father given name is Gudjon. His son would be 'X' Eidurson. His daughter would be 'X' Eidursdottir.
More people are opting to switch the order of surnames for their offspring, to allow the mother's surname to 'go on'.
:crazyeyes Dont the women feel appalled, patronised and demeaned that their surname isn't as important as the man's surname!
Or maybe they just get on with it because there's more important things to worry about
Ah ok!
I have changed my surname once in my life time, i will not be doing it again, and i think more women should use ms.
Women don't have to take any name they don't want to.
Other than 'bitch' of course.
My choice was to change my name and status when i got married. I was proud to get married, and when we have children, I will want to be part of my family with them, so it was important that we would all have the same surname when that happens. Plus I HATED my maiden name, and would have got it changed formally anyway if I'd not married someone, so I just don't feel bothered in the least with losing a previous 'identity'.
My mother gave me her surname when I was born, my parents split up when I was young and my mother married someone else and changed her name, so my surname was tied up with 'not belonging' to a family. I do not want my future children to feel like that when they are growing up.
So I guess there are different stories to consider when assuming that a particular tradition is archaic and demeaning. I 'went along blindly' with tradition to ensure that both myself and my future children belong somewhere and don't feel as abnormal and 'unsafe' as I did growing up.
i might love the person i marry, but i should equally love myself, and my identity as a person asides being someone's wife...
Yes there is.
It just happenes behind closed doors.
I am, always have been and always will be a 'Ms'. My parents used to tell me not to be a Ms because people might think I'm a lesbian, or a feminist. :rolleyes:
I am also considering changing my surname.
I sympathise with the article. I don't see how a man's marital status should remain secretive whilst a female's is suggestive as to whether or not she is open to ownership... Yes, the aforementioned sentence sounds extreme and I mean it in more of a historical context than reflective of [Christian] marriage today. I feel a bit infantilised if I am called 'Miss', just like if I'm called a 'girl'. I'm mid twenties, my marital status is my business and I tend to associate 'miss' with a little kid or something. :rolleyes:
Saying that, I much prefer it when people call me 'sir' (jk).
I guess thats the problem then.
It doesn't.
This is the thing, you don't have to change your name or title. You have the choice, that's equality.
Because some women choose to go traditional doesn't mean that choice disapears.
what planet are you on?
there is a hell of a lot of abuse in the country and the figures just keep rising every year, female circumcision does happen within somali and minority groups within the UK, and is a big problem, forced marriages are happening and don't just happen to those from asian backgrounds.
why does nobody else see this stuff? its well enough reported but yet everyone glides over it.
Where does TheSite find these boring, on-message "feminists" to write this crap? Honestly, the article almost sent me off to sleep. If that's the best article someone can write after spending nearly 3 years at university, it's not a good advertisement for higher education.
Either take your new husband's name or don't take your new husband's name. Still, I doubt any man would want to marry someone who obsesses so much over something so trivial.