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What does the future hold for first time buyers?

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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ricardo R wrote: »
    If you get a low salary, then you have to rent until you either get paid more/get a better job, or get a partner = hopefully ~double the income. I don't see what the big deal is, you can't have your cake and eat it, ie have a low-paid job then complain you can't get a mortgage. There's millions of Britons earning £10-15k and having to rent, they just get on with life, not whinge that they can't get on the property ladder - in the grand scheme of things, big sodding deal, a roof is a roof!!

    My point is that you said "I don't understand how people struggle to buy a house. ". I'm simply proving to you why people struggle.

    People don't chose to have low paid jobs, and it used to be that people with low paid jobs could afford to get on the housing market. This is why there is an issue with house prices today and why people complain about them.

    Oh and a roof doesn't make a home btw.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kazbo wrote: »
    My point is that you said "I don't understand how people struggle to buy a house. ". I'm simply proving to you why people struggle.
    K... didn't literally mean 100% of the population, I was responding to the OP's "I just wondered how on earth any young person/couples can afford to buy their first home".
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Since the average salary in the UK is 22k....I think it's safe to say the OP has a point that it is becoming increasingly difficult for anyone to buy a house, particularly on their own.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ricardo R wrote: »
    If you get a low salary, then you have to rent until you either get paid more/get a better job, or get a partner = hopefully ~double the income. I don't see what the big deal is, you can't have your cake and eat it, ie have a low-paid job then complain you can't get a mortgage. There's millions of Britons earning £10-15k and having to rent, they just get on with life, not whinge that they can't get on the property ladder - in the grand scheme of things, big sodding deal, a roof is a roof!!

    easy for you to say
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Thanks.

    I was just after some feed back. From most of the people I've spoken to, I should just start saving as much as poss from as early as poss. I'm not fortunate enough to gain financial support from the parents, as they rent off the council, so we're not very well off I'm afraid. Oh gosh.

    Also, my qualified 'Staff Nurse' wage isn't going to be enough to support a house/flat buying anytime soon once I've graduated!!
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    You'll get some key-worker malarkey, won't you?
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Fingers crossed eh ;)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ballerina wrote: »
    easy for you to say
    What? I rented until I was able to buy a place. Other people will have to spend more time renting, so what. It's not like the quality of life renting is significantly inferior to owning your own property, oh boo I can't paint the wall pink, someone kill me now :rolleyes:
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Curvy_lass wrote: »
    Also, my qualified 'Staff Nurse' wage isn't going to be enough to support a house/flat buying anytime soon once I've graduated!!
    Find a rich bloke :razz: hellloooo nurse...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Men and nurses. Seriously mate, the uniforms are ROUGH!
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ricardo R wrote: »
    What? I rented until I was able to buy a place. Other people will have to spend more time renting, so what. It's not like the quality of life renting is significantly inferior to owning your own property, oh boo I can't paint the wall pink, someone kill me now :rolleyes:

    To me it was. Renting always felt like throwing money away and that went against everything I'd ever been brought up to believe. I felt I was constantly walking around on egg shells in the place in case I did any damage. I wanted the freedom of not having a landlord breathing down my neck about things. I wanted the responsibilty of my own place and the security that offers in knowing there wasn't the chance I could be kicked out at any time. I always said a rented property would never be home and it wasn't.

    I've lived for a year previously in the area I now live and absolutely hated it. Moved back there now and love it, it is home and I no longer see my parents house as where home is, all becuase I own my own house. So you can say all you like a rented place is only the same - it definately isn't to me and many other people I know.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ricardo R wrote: »
    What? I rented until I was able to buy a place. Other people will have to spend more time renting, so what. It's not like the quality of life renting is significantly inferior to owning your own property, oh boo I can't paint the wall pink, someone kill me now :rolleyes:
    its not as easy for everyone to move up the career ladder, just because you've done it, many can't. There are also circumstances changing etc that can stop people from being able to.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kazbo wrote: »
    To me it was. Renting always felt like throwing money away and that went against everything I'd ever been brought up to believe. I felt I was constantly walking around on egg shells in the place in case I did any damage. I wanted the freedom of not having a landlord breathing down my neck about things. I wanted the responsibilty of my own place and the security that offers in knowing there wasn't the chance I could be kicked out at any time. I always said a rented property would never be home and it wasn't.

    I've lived for a year previously in the area I now live and absolutely hated it. Moved back there now and love it, it is home and I no longer see my parents house as where home is, all becuase I own my own house. So you can say all you like a rented place is only the same - it definately isn't to me and many other people I know.
    Fair does.. I feel the same as I did renting, there's a "superior landlord" who owns the building all our accommodation is in so I think I can still be kicked out if I make too much noise! Also Sky TV dishes are banned. :crying: As for rent 'throwing money away', no different to paying interest repayments on the mortgage- unless you can afford to quickly reduce your mortgage itself you're throwing money away monthly. Anyhow, as shit as people may find renting, I still don't think it's a big deal in the grand scheme of things, there's bigger problems to worry about, you should feel grateful you've got shelter etc etc...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    rachie004 wrote: »
    You are making me so angry that I want to cry

    It's not worth it :no:

    There's no way I'd be able to move back to my home town, even with my boyfriend's salary and my salary as a jr doctor combined. In the early 1980s my dad bought a 3 bedroom detached property in Surrey for £53,000. Just had a look online, and a house down our road with the same number of bedrooms is on offer for £500,000...
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ricardo R wrote: »
    Fair does.. I feel the same as I did renting, there's a "superior landlord" who owns the building all our accommodation is in so I think I can still be kicked out if I make too much noise! Also Sky TV dishes are banned. :crying: As for rent 'throwing money away', no different to paying interest repayments on the mortgage- unless you can afford to quickly reduce your mortgage itself you're throwing money away monthly. Anyhow, as shit as people may find renting, I still don't think it's a big deal in the grand scheme of things, there's bigger problems to worry about, you should feel grateful you've got shelter etc etc...

    See I don't have any restrictions on my property. It's mine to do what I want with, no one to pay a lease to and so on. I'm not just paying the interest repayments on my mortgage and do hope to make substantial overpayments within the terms allowed on it, so no I'm not throwing money away by having my own property, so it's completely different to renting in my case.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ricardo R wrote: »
    Anyhow, as shit as people may find renting, I still don't think it's a big deal in the grand scheme of things, there's bigger problems to worry about, you should feel grateful you've got shelter etc etc...[/FONT]

    I don't like renting. I constantly feel as though the landlord is going to come round and let himself in. Why should I feel grateful I have shelter? Living in a developed country, it's pretty much a basic right, and I don't feel grateful to be lining the pockets of some rich bloke.


    to the op, nurses wages aren't so bad. My friend has just bought a house on a new nurses wage. Granted she bought with her partner, but even on her own, she would have been able to get a mortgage on a smaller place. It depends where you want to live though. :)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ricardo R wrote: »
    I remember reading that the average Briton earns £40k+ at the peak of their career

    The average UK wage is a smudge over #26,000pa, and the average family income is a smudge over #33,000pa.

    Not for the first time, you are talking utter shite. You grossly overestimate how much people earn, which really doesn't surprise me.

    For the record, I'm a Durham grad (so I'm pretty clever, even if I say so myself) any my graduate job pays about #18,000. We can afford to buy because my wife earns the same and our parents gave us a deposit, but our house is only worth #100,000. That wouldn't buy you anything in London.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    That wouldn't buy you anything in London.

    A parking space or garage perhaps.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    go_away wrote: »
    A parking space or garage perhaps.

    A nice shopping trolley with a view ;)
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Kermit wrote: »
    The average UK wage is a smudge over #26,000pa, and the average family income is a smudge over #33,000pa.

    Not for the first time, you are talking utter shite. You grossly overestimate how much people earn, which really doesn't surprise me.
    AT THE PEAK OF THEIR CAREER, I said. ie when a person is aged like 40-45 at the very strongest point in their career eg most senior, that's when they're on ~£40k. If the average wage for people of all ages is £26k then £40k at their peak is plausible - most people's wages greatly change with greater experience and seniority.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Can you not grasp the fact that the majority of jobs/careers, will NEVER PAY £40,000???
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    katchika wrote: »
    Can you not grasp the fact that the majority of jobs/careers, will NEVER PAY £40,000???
    Ooh I really don't know about that. I would think maybe 50-60% of jobs, if you start age 20-25, by the peak of your career (in your 40s usually) you will be on £40k+. Teacher, policeman, army, journalist, etc - you start on maybe £20k but if you stay in the job into your 40s you're likely to move up the career ladder, become more senior and reach £40k. Same with your typical plumber, carpenter - start as a lowly apprentice, by your 40s you're likely to be quite well established and bringing in that sort of money.

    I find it hard to believe that City grads make in their first year out of uni more than the majority of the UK will ever make at the peak of their career - there'd be uproar if that was true.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I don't know about all of those other careers but as a trainee journalist I started on £250 a week (before tax), which works out as £13,000. A senior reporter on the daily regional evening paper here gets around £20-£25,000.

    Not everyone in life is going to move up to the highest point of their career ladder.

    At the moment I'm dealing with job applications for a recycling company. There are guys in their 40s applying for jobs who were made redundant from Rover, they were on fairly decent wages and are now trying to get jobs that pay £230 a week.


    You don't seem to take into account in your equation that millions of people in this country work in low paid sectors such as care work, shop work and catering. Very few will earn anywhere near your figures in their life.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    katchika wrote: »
    I don't know about all of those other careers but as a trainee journalist I started on £250 a week (before tax), which works out as £13,000. A senior reporter on the daily regional evening paper here gets around £20-£25,000.

    Not everyone in life is going to move up to the highest point of their career ladder.

    At the moment I'm dealing with job applications for a recycling company. There are guys in their 40s applying for jobs who were made redundant from Rover, they were on fairly decent wages and are now trying to get jobs that pay £230 a week.

    You don't seem to take into account in your equation that millions of people in this country work in low paid sectors such as care work, shop work and catering. Very few will earn anywhere near your figures in their life.
    I'm taking them into consideration by saying ~50-60% will be getting over £40k at their peak, ~40-50% are in low paid sectors so won't. Journalism you start low but get higher with experience - if you think at their peak local reporters are on £25k, national journos £40k, section editors £60-70k etc the £40k average is about right.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Maybe, but an average figure is pretty meaningless, considering the minority of people earning a high wage bump up the average.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ricardo R wrote: »
    Ooh I really don't know about that. I would think maybe 50-60% of jobs, if you start age 20-25, by the peak of your career (in your 40s usually) you will be on £40k+. Teacher, policeman, army, journalist, etc - you start on maybe £20k but if you stay in the job into your 40s you're likely to move up the career ladder, become more senior and reach £40k. Same with your typical plumber, carpenter - start as a lowly apprentice, by your 40s you're likely to be quite well established and bringing in that sort of money.

    I find it hard to believe that City grads make in their first year out of uni more than the majority of the UK will ever make at the peak of their career - there'd be uproar if that was true.


    In all the careers you have mentioned it is only the people who get to the top that make that sort of money. However, due to the pyramid structure of any organisation very few people do ever get to those jobs. Teachers for example have to get to deputy head to be getting 40k normally. Many people will start a job in the 20's and whilst they get pay rises and promotions the actual end salary will not be significantly greater when you take into account inflation during their working life.

    People have a different attitude to city grads and it's a lifestyle that not many people can hack or want to hack and therefore accept that they will be earning drastically more. However, you then take a company like mine who don't even give London scalings and their grads are meant to live on the same as I'm living on.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Ricardo, you really do make me laugh. A primary school headteacher, or a secondary school deputy head, only earn about #40,000, and as you well know, most teachers can't be a headteacher. A senior nurse earns about #35,000.

    For most of these people the "peak" of their career is in their 50s. A bit late to be getting the first steps on the property ladder, don't you think?
    I find it hard to believe that City grads make in their first year out of uni more than the majority of the UK will ever make at the peak of their career - there'd be uproar if that was true.

    I think that's the most telling thing you've said. City pay packets have nothing to do with reality, and they haven't had since the early 1980s.

    A good friend of ours is a successful grad with RBS, and she earns in a year what I earn in five.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    its all well and good saying that the majority of people will earn £40k+ in their 40s but most people want to move out well before then, usually late teens, early 20s

    also, not everybody is a graduate, quite a lot of people don't go to university!!!!!

    i earn £13000 a year before tax, and am in quite a bit of debt so can't even think about looking at moving out until I've paid everything off so I still live at home with my parents :(
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Oh and as for renting, what about when you have retired? Where on earth would you get the money from to do that? And it's not like we're going to get a state pension, is it.
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    Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,323 The Mix Honorary Guru
    my boyf and I bought our first house last year. (note: I'm a graduate who earns well below the average graduate wage) We've had to make a lot of compromises financially and the property needs a lot of work but I think we've made the right decision as we don't pay that much more month on month than we did when we were renting. That said, now we quite simply wouldn't be able to afford our property - other houses on our road are going for about £20,000 over what we paid. And unfortunately these are going to buy-to-letters and these are first time buyers properties really as they only have 1 good sized bedroom, its ridiculous.

    There are schemes where you can buy 40% of a property and rent the rest which I thought was quite a good idea until I saw Dispatches on Monday and they were pointing out all the cons of this. Ultimately all I can say is that I have to be selfish and hope prices don't slump completely or we're f***ed. I don't know what the answer is other than more affordable housing and a clamp down on smaller properties going to buy-to- letters (if that is possible!) - as I feel a lot of potential homeowners are missing on wonderful first time buyer properties because of this.
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