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Should these three words be banned from music?

Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/6586787.stm

The founder of Def Jam records has called for the words ho, bitch and nigger to be banned from songs. What do you think?
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Comments

  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Why?? and no.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Nigger - yes. But what's wrong with 'bitch'?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    katchika wrote: »
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/6586787.stm

    The founder of Def Jam records has called for the words ho, bitch and nigger to be banned from songs. What do you think?

    There’s a lot worse prose in the Daily Mail.
  • Teh_GerbilTeh_Gerbil Stalin's Organist Posts: 13,327
    In all fairness, this is addressed better with the song by Anthrax "Startin' Up A Posse"

    So, no.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I agree with many of the points he makes, and a lot of modern hip-hop that uses these words a lot is thoroughly bullshit, but to suggest that banning three particular words will change the attitude in the lyrics is ridiculous. Of course the retards they're trying to appease with this sort of legislation are the type of people who obviously lack the intelligence to see any such language in context. These are the same type of people who get outraged at one scene they've heard about in a film, despite knowing nothing about the plot or the context in which the scene appears. If this was a call for record companies to refuse to support obviously misogynistic messages in music, then I would have no problem with that, any more than music with openly racist or homophobic messages, which they don't currently support.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Freedom of speech anyone?

    The whole principle of freedom of speech is being able to say unpopular, controversial or downright offensive things. Otherwise, there would be no such notion or any need for such a thing as freedom of speech.

    If we start throwing barriers up against what people can and cannot say, you will have opened the floodgates and it will provide people with enough evidence and justification to call for the 'banning' of any words that might be seen to cause offence. Where will it end? I mean, the Tipper Gores of this world already got their way putting the parental logo on CDs with naughty words in the lyrics. This is another attempt to further constrain liberties and expressions because a very reactionary minority take offence to it.

    Yet another example of society being called in to deal with the problems that parents can't be fucked to deal with.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    While we're at it, let's ban all forms of freedom of expression.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Freedom of speech anyone?

    The whole principle of freedom of speech is being able to say unpopular, controversial or downright offensive things.

    :thumb:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Freedom of speech anyone?

    The whole principle of freedom of speech is being able to say unpopular, controversial or downright offensive things. Otherwise, there would be no such notion or any need for such a thing as freedom of speech.

    And it also includes the freedom of those paying for the record to be made, not to pay for something which expresses an opinion they don't agree with or don't want to be associated with. I don't see anything wrong with someone using their free speech to suggest to record companies that they don't associate with artists that they feel express such views. If there's a big enough audience for it, then they'll find a distributor. If no-one agree with what they're saying, then tough shit, fund it yourself, and don't be surprised that no-one buys it.

    Incidentally, I can think of a few things I'd ban first. The word "Baby", anything where they add an extra "h" in the word because it doesn't have enough syllables and they're too lazy to think of anything else (e.g. "I can't live without you-hoo-hoo-hoo"), and anything with that most annoying of sounds, teenage girls screaming or chanting lyrics.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    And it also includes the freedom of those paying for the record to be made, not to pay for something which expresses an opinion they don't agree with or don't want to be associated with. I don't see anything wrong with someone using their free speech to suggest to record companies that they don't associate with artists that they feel express such views. If there's a big enough audience for it, then they'll find a distributor. If no-one agree with what they're saying, then tough shit, fund it yourself, and don't be surprised that no-one buys it.

    Incidentally, I can think of a few things I'd ban first. The word "Baby", anything where they add an extra "h" in the word because it doesn't have enough syllables and they're too lazy to think of anything else (e.g. "I can't live without you-hoo-hoo-hoo"), and anything with that most annoying of sounds, teenage girls screaming or chanting lyrics.

    Firstly, we're not talking about one or two companies. The founder of Def Jam asked that the whole industry ban this. It's one thing if an individual company doesn't want to release a record because of their personal beliefs. Just remember back to EMI and the Sex Pistols but a blanket, industry-wide ban is tantamount to stifling of free expression.

    Do you not realise the implications of banning even a few words? If it happens, it shows the world and all the neo-con/neo-fascist types out there that the music industry has conceded to them. After that, we would see a whole raft of bans being made against certain words that people found offensive. We can't pick and choose what words we back up with freedom of speech or not. I don't necessarily like or condone the use of words like 'nigger' but I will defend anyone's right to use it with every ounce of strength I have. Either it's every word is ok, or no word is ok. We can't pick and choose.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Has he any power to ban these words? And if its a voluntary boycott other companies will agree with him or they won't and it is up to them which position they take
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Incidentally, I can think of a few things I'd ban first. The word "Baby", anything where they add an extra "h" in the word because it doesn't have enough syllables and they're too lazy to think of anything else (e.g. "I can't live without you-hoo-hoo-hoo"), and anything with that most annoying of sounds, teenage girls screaming or chanting lyrics.

    :yes:
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Firstly, we're not talking about one or two companies. The founder of Def Jam asked that the whole industry ban this. It's one thing if an individual company doesn't want to release a record because of their personal beliefs. Just remember back to EMI and the Sex Pistols but a blanket, industry-wide ban is tantamount to stifling of free expression.
    Yes, on a company-by-company, voluntary basis. Surely by your definition there are plenty of bands out there that are already having their freedom of expression infringed upon (I struggle to see how you come to the conclusion that refusing to pay huge sums of money to market and distribute their music is infringing on their freedom of expression). I think you'll struggle to find any white power or holocaust denier bands being funded by mainstream record companies, for example.
    Do you not realise the implications of banning even a few words?
    You seem to be confusing "banning" something with simply not giving it your financial backing or facilitating it. Bearing in mind that the record companies have an decreasing influence on what gets heard nowadays (considering the internet in particular) I don't see a problem with record companies exercising their right to only fund musicians that portray a message or opinion that they want to be associated with.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Has he any power to ban these words?
    He hasn't, it's simply a suggestion, which is why I see no problem with it whatsoever. And this is the reason why:
    And if its a voluntary boycott other companies will agree with him or they won't and it is up to them which position they take
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    no, musicians should never be censored.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    the wurzels would be out of business if they couldn't say ho...as in a hoe...:D
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    No I don't agree with this.

    It is mainly black hip hop artists who use the word "nigger", and it isn't actually meant in an offensive, racist way. It is just part of their lingo and a term that they use for their mates. Don't see a problem with it.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    They should just ban Gangsta rap, can't stand the stuff. (personal opinion, not a political statement boys and girls!)
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    pill 'ed wrote: »
    No I don't agree with this.

    It is mainly black hip hop artists who use the word "nigger", and it isn't actually meant in an offensive, racist way. It is just part of their lingo and a term that they use for their mates. Don't see a problem with it.

    Not all hip hop artists use the term or like the term. Listen to Public Enemy "Yo Nigga!".
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    awwww was hoping the words would be "i love you" and "yes i do" :(
  • smitherzsmitherz Converted to the darkside Posts: 968
    There is a big difference in saying a word, and saying a word and meaning it in a racist way. Personally i don't have a problem with it, if you don't like it then don't listen to it
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Blagsta wrote: »
    Not all hip hop artists use the term or like the term. Listen to Public Enemy "Yo Nigga!".

    I know, that's why I said mainly. But still, alot do.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Also, surely banning words like nigger are going to have a reaaally bad effect from a racism point of view? Biggots will pick up on the fact that the word causes offence to some black people and use it waaay more in a derogatory way.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    I think these terms have become cliched and meaningless this past few years.

    Hip hop/rap artists that used the word "nigger" in the late 80's/early 90's are a different kettle of fish to the one's that use it these days. It meant something then, it doesn't now.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    katchika wrote: »
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/6586787.stm

    The founder of Def Jam records has called for the words ho, bitch and nigger to be banned from songs. What do you think?
    No... But I think people should look at homophobic artists like Eminem.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Namaste wrote: »
    No... But I think people should look at homophobic artists like Eminem.

    Wouldn't that imply that one group deserves more protection than another?
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Namaste wrote: »
    No... But I think people should look at homophobic artists like Eminem.

    You do know he's not actually homophobic, right? It's some lame PR thing he does because it appeals to his 16 year old neds for fans.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Jim V wrote: »
    Wouldn't that imply that one group deserves more protection than another?

    Exactly. Being homophobic is no more bad than being sexist, racist or whatever. Either allow all words or no words. There is no such thing as a happy medium.

    If you think he's homophobic/racists/whatever then don't buy his albums. Parents should be aware of what their kids are listening to and act accordingly as good parents would. Don't leave it to the government or the system to raise your kids because it will fuck things up for more people than it helps.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Namaste wrote: »
    No... But I think people should look at homophobic artists like Eminem.

    Slim Shady is not homophobic. He's said he's not many times, and he's worked with Elton John.

    Part of what Eminem is about, is not giving a fuck and just writing what comes to his head. The homophobic lyrics of his older albums weren't meant offensively, he was just writing lyrics that would have been a common way of talking where he grew up. It doesn't mean that he actually dislikes homosexuals.
  • Former MemberFormer Member Posts: 1,876,328 The Mix Honorary Guru
    Jim V wrote: »
    Wouldn't that imply that one group deserves more protection than another?
    Well I think it depends. The word "n*gger" is often used as a colloquilism in rap music, which is different to homophobia in rap and reggae.

    The whole misogyny and the use of the words "bitches" and "ho" and talking about acts of violence towards women is also distrubing. Even if these rappers are not misogynist at all in person, it's what their lyrics say really.. Bearing in mind people of low intelligence and kids are likely listening to this music.

    I don't believe in censorship of the arts (until it comes to people being hurt against their will directly), but I think some artists really should be more responsible.
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